Debates of March 9th, 2007

This is page numbers 1381 - 1424 of the Hansard for the 15th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was going .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Making Communities Safer

Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Devolution Of Federal Government Public Service Positions

Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Passing Of John Carroll

Acknowledgement Of The Achievements Of Nunakput Residents

Compensation For GNWT Public Servants

Acknowledgement Of The Achievements Of Sahtu Residents

Concerns Regarding The Workers' Compensation Board

Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Devolution Of Federal Government Civil Service Positions

Community Funding Under The Water And Sewage Services Policy

Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Compensation For GNWT Public Servants

Diamond Mines Impact Benefit Agreements

Written Question 54-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Aurora College Students Housing 55-15(5): Aurora College Students Housing

Written Question 56-15(5): Location Of New Public Service Positions

Revert To Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Committee Report 11-15(5): Standing Committee On Accountability And Oversight Final Progress Report On Priorities And Objectives

Motion To Receive And Adopt Committee Report 11-15(5)

Tabled Document 109-15(5): Policing In The Territories: Report On A Public Consultation Process, March 2006

Tabled Document 110-15(5): Proposed Safer Communities And Neighbourhoods Act Public Consultation Results

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Revert To Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

To Delete $682,000 From Human Resources, Operations Expenditures In Bill 22, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 3, 2006-2007

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Bill 21: Appropriation Act, 2007-2008

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Brendan Bell , Mr. Braden , Honourable Paul Delorey , Honourable Charles Dent , Mrs. Groenewegen , Honourable Joe Handley , Mr. Hawkins , Honourable David Krutko , Mr. Lafferty , Ms. Lee , Hon. Michael McLeod , Mr. McLeod, Hon. Kevin Menicoche , Mr. Miltenberger , Mr. Pokiak , Mr. Ramsay , Honourable Floyd Roland , Mr. Villeneuve , Mr. Yakeleya

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---Prayer

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 1381

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Good morning, colleagues. Welcome back to the House. Orders of the day. Ministers' statements. The honourable Minister of Justice , Mr. Bell .

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Minister's Statement 83-15(5): Making Communities Safer

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1381

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, community safety is a shared responsibility. We all have a role to play in this; the RCMP, governments at all levels, and residents.

During the community policing consultations in 2004 and 2005, the department heard from people in every community. Every session, participants talked about property crimes, alcohol abuse, drug trafficking, illegal drug use, domestic violence, sexual assault and dangerous driving. Later today, at the appropriate time, I will table the final report on these consultations.

Mr. Speaker, I want to thank NWT residents for participating in these consultations. This government heard their concerns and intends to respond to them.

Over the last three years, this government has created 28 new RCMP positions in communities, including a police dog and handler. Government has also secured the funding to establish a new detachment in Sachs Harbour and worked with the RCMP to create new ways of responding to community needs, like the Gameti winter road project.

---Applause

Mr. Speaker, the most recent example is the command restructuring in the Tlicho region. Behchoko is now coordinating policing activities for the entire region as a piloted approach to improving police services.

---Applause

But, Mr. Speaker, as we know, the RCMP can't do this alone. Communities have developed their own alternative justice systems and they are active in crime prevention, on-the-land activities and diversions from the courts to community justice committees. I am pleased to say that victim support services have recently been expanded to Fort Simpson and additional funding for victims have been included in our 2007-08 budget.

Residents are taking action by developing neighbourhood watch programs. In Yellowknife, this has expanded to the Citizens on Patrol program where volunteers tour the city

and report illegal behaviour to the RCMP. Residents of Inuvik have also expressed interest in setting up a similar program, Mr. Speaker.

This government is also hard at work on a variety of initiatives designed to help victims. The Protection Against Family Violence Act has been in effect for almost two years now and it has provided protection for almost 200 families who are suffering from violence in their own homes. The department has toured the territory giving presentations to community groups and providing information about this law in eight of the NWT's official languages.

As Members know, we have also been exploring new ways of making communities safer through safer communities and neighbourhoods legislation. This proposed legislation gives residents a way to take back their communities from bootlegging, drug dealing and other illegal activities that are habitually disturbing the neighbourhood. We've all heard stories about bootleggers who take over elders' homes or drug houses that make young families fear for their safety. Mr. Speaker, this government believes this behaviour is unacceptable. We cannot let illegal activities consume our communities.

In January, the department completed preliminary consultations on proposed safer communities legislation for the NWT. Later today, at the appropriate time, I will table the results of those consultations.

Mr. Speaker, I have also asked the department to investigate the possibility of developing involuntary detoxification legislation similar to laws that are in place in Saskatchewan and Alberta. This legislation is a last resort for teenagers with severe drug or alcohol addictions who need to be detained in a safe place to ensure their own safety or the safety of someone else. It allows the teen to undergo medical detox to prepare for addictions treatment and could be an effective way to help young people. Mr. Speaker, given our full legislative agenda, I am planning to provide options for consideration of the next Legislative Assembly.

Mr. Speaker, all of these efforts are being made with the primary goal of making our communities safer and healthier for ourselves, our children and our elders. Strong, vibrant communities are the cornerstones of our territory's self-reliance and a goal that is fundamental to the vision this Assembly has been working towards since we all took office nearly four years ago. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 83-15(5): Making Communities Safer

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1381

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Ministers' statements. Members' statements. Honourable Member for Thebacha , Mr. Miltenberger .

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue of resource revenue sharing has taken up a considerable amount of time in this House and the sense of frustration is clear. It's almost palpable at times. The circumstances we have in the three terms I have been here is that we are still negotiating. Ottawa gets the gravy and, as the Premier said in this House a couple of days ago, we get shafted.

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

Some Hon. Members

Shafted!

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, this is an issue of unresolved concern. It's clear now that the issue isn't going to be addressed in the budget, that we are going to have to continue to negotiate. But as we negotiate, one of the flaws has been we continue to have billions of dollars of revenue extracted through resource development and the results, the goods, going south, and that continued to happen. There is no incentive for the federal government to resolve or come to a deal with us because we keep approving development projects.

So we are in a situation where we talk about this, we complain about it, we have all sorts of heartburn and angst. We vent our spleens in this House. We pound the table. But millions keep going south and we stand by in our own land as humble mendicants, tugging our forelock and shuffling our feet, asking for a piece of the pie; so far unsuccessfully.

The other great concern, Mr. Speaker, is these are all non-renewable resources. Every carat, every barrel of oil, every cubic foot of gas, every ounce of gold, once it's gone it's gone. The people of the Northwest Territories will never get the long-term benefit. This is a very difficult situation and not sustainable.

We talk about a heritage fund. The concern will be that by the time we get a deal, there won't be enough left to create a heritage fund for those northerners who are yet unborn who we're planning for.

Mr. Speaker, I would suggest that as we move into the 16th Assembly that it is time for us to look very clearly at what should we do as a plan B to try to improve the negotiations. To me, what we should be clearly considering is that, in the 16th Assembly, any new resource development be put on hold, that there be a moratorium. Those projects currently underway in the development process application process, fine. But we should not continue to give away our resources...

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Mr. Miltenberger , your time for Member's statement has expired.

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Miltenberger .

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. So, Mr. Speaker, we should be looking at, as we move into the 16th Assembly, a moratorium on any new resource development to help until we can conclude this deal and give enough incentive for all parties to actually make this deal, once and for all, finally, for future generations of northerners yet unborn. Thank you.

---Applause

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Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty .

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Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mr. Speaker, today I would like to talk about post-secondary education in my region. As we have talked about in the House on a number of occasions, there have been great successes in the Monfwi region over the past decade related to education. From 20 years ago when a few people graduated high school education from our region, our Tlicho Community Services Agency have implemented great extensions in two of our communities: Behchoko and Whati. It's been a great success to date, Mr. Speaker.

Today, as a region, we are graduating more aboriginal graduates than any other regions in the Northwest Territories. Our high school, the Chief Jimmy Bruneau School, has recently been chosen as one of the 10 best aboriginal schools in Canada.

---Applause

We'll shortly be celebrating a book about these schools and segments on APTN, Mr. Speaker. Our agency, too, has won an award this past year; the National Innovation in Management Award for Institute of Public Administration of Canada.

Our Tlicho Government has also contributed a great deal to this process as well, pleased with the number of graduates coming through our school system. A number of years ago they implemented a post-secondary scholarship program delivered through agency; in intervening years have given millions of dollars to our graduates who have gone on to post-secondary education. Indeed, this year we have over 120 students attending post-secondary education across Canada and receiving thousands of dollars from each of the Tlicho Governments. We're proud to see their achievement, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Lafferty .

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Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1382

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mahsi, colleagues. Aurora College and the Department of Education have helped where they could and have worked hard to implement special programming in the communities, such as teacher education programming.

---Applause

However, Mr. Speaker, it is not enough. On a regional basis, in our four communities we have only one full-time permanent college instructor. One, Mr. Speaker. We used to have more, but over the years these resources have been cut. Other instructors in the communities are on a short-term basis. However, we still have many, many adults in the communities who want to finish their high school education so they can go on to further, training and post-secondary education. Mr.

Speaker, however, I understand that Minister has plans to remove the funding for the attendance of these 22 years of age adult students in our schools. Those are the questions that I will have for the Minister at a later point. Mahsi.

---Applause

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Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .

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Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, just today I want to use my Member's statement to talk about the federal government socio-economic impact funding of $500 million, which does not include the Akaitcho territory or the Tlicho territory. Mr. Speaker, in the socio-economic baseline study, the area, and I quote, in the study it says "includes all the communities in the NWT in which the direct or indirect effects of gas production and pipeline construction may affect permanent residents." Also, Mr. Speaker, this study even included north-western Alberta. Mr.

Speaker, the exclusion of the Akaitcho territory and the Tlicho territory in the ability to access this large funding source from the federal government is just another blatant display of disrespect and disassociation of fairness and unity towards many northerners by the federal government and Mackenzie gas proponents, and especially by this government, the government of our people, for not being the first ones to raise the red flag on this type of injustice.

We have all heard many times in this House and many other forums that on this Mackenzie gas project that this ripple effect of such a massive development will be felt by all communities in the NWT and others beyond our borders, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, although the Mackenzie gas development impacts may vary in severity depending on where you're living, does not exclude the fact that this socio-economic impact funding should be distributed amongst all communities in the NWT.

Implore that this government should negotiate a similar socio-economic impact fund for communities that were left out of this agreement and raise the seriousness to the federal government of this issue and let them know that we cannot, and will not, take this kind of treatment lying down. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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Devolution Of Federal Government Public Service Positions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mahsi. Good morning, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there have been a couple of media accounts in the last couple of days about ongoing discussions and negotiations for devolution and moving northern programs now vested in Ottawa actually into the North. What a radical concept, Mr. Speaker. But it seems that, as in past attempts to transfer these programs, we are again running into the issue of the transfer of employees now based in southern Canada into the North and coming into the family here with the GNWT's workforce.

Mr. Speaker, that stalemate is quite understandable. These are people who have lives, and careers, and families, and investments, and homes in other parts of Canada and it is not something to be taken for granted, or taken lightly, that they would simply pick up and move. But it's been characterized that we have this I think 20 percent differential in our pay packet that we have to resolve.

Mr. Speaker, we're talking about a landmark evolution in the future of the Northwest Territories and yet, as we have experienced and seen in the past, we are hung up at least in part on the situation involving, we understand, about 170 federal employees. I want to sympathize with their concerns, but I also think, Mr. Speaker, that this is about more than money. It's about the challenge, perhaps, and the fear of moving to a new part of Canada.

When my family moved here from Saskatchewan in 1964, I know that our relatives and neighbours in the small town that we came from figured that we were going to fall off the edge of the earth. Well, we're still here. I also remember, Mr. Speaker, in 1967 being at the airport here in Yellowknife and watching a chartered plane from Ottawa filled with federal southern bureaucrats who were ready to take on the job of helping to build the North. That, I think, is where we should go today.

Mr. Speaker, I'd like to issue a personal invitation to the people who are considering or having this option to move North to think about...

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Devolution Of Federal Government Public Service Positions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Your time for Member's statement has expired, Mr. Braden .

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Devolution Of Federal Government Public Service Positions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Devolution Of Federal Government Public Service Positions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude his statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Mr. Braden .

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Devolution Of Federal Government Public Service Positions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

Bill Braden

Great Slave

Mr. Speaker, the NWT is an exceptionally terrific place to raise a family. I think we can all attest to that. Offices and jobs can be created here in Yellowknife, but also in many of the other communities of the NWT -- Fort Smith, Hay River, Norman Wells, Fort Simpson, Inuvik -- all of which we know we want to create these positions, see these jobs, these very valuable jobs, come. I'd like to extend that invitation to any of those employees and their families in Ottawa who might be just a little bit worried about coming North. I understand. Call us. We have a 1-800 number. Get in touch with us.

We'd like you to come up here and we'd like you to help us continue to build the NWT. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Devolution Of Federal Government Public Service Positions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1383

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Braden . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .

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Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1384

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today I want to discuss the issue of our relationship with the federal government and how we continue to just go along with being taken advantage of. We only have six months left in the life of this government and judging by the atmosphere and comments in this Legislature, both the government and Members of this House are beginning to feel the pressure that once again another government will come and go with absolutely nothing to show for its efforts in Ottawa.

We are extremely fortunate as a territory to have so much opportunity before us in the area of resource development. It has brought many jobs to our people. However, as a government, we continue to pay the price for developing these resources. The costs, Mr. Speaker, are undeniable. We continue to pay without any guarantee of a return. We pay for road infrastructure, for health care, education, and other services, all the while watching millions and millions of dollars leaving our territory each and every year.

Mr. Speaker, when will we have surety on our future? When will the federal government understand that they must share the resources that they are taking from us? When?

Mr. Speaker, let's be clear. The pressure is mounting. In fact, our Premier was in the press earlier this week, Mr. Speaker, saying that if he did not get a deal with Ottawa, he would seek re-election. Well, Mr. Premier , you better dust off the election signs. Mahsi.

---Applause

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Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1384

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Passing Of John Carroll

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1384

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, last week we attended the funeral of John Carroll in Hay River. Born in Newfoundland in 1925, John had a very interesting life. At age 16 he left Newfoundland, which was still a British colony at that time. He became a school teacher and a monk with the Irish-Christian Brotherhood in Harlem, New York; a very unique way of starting a teaching career.

After seven years, he took a break from teaching, moved to Montreal, becoming a Canadian citizen when Newfoundland became a part of Canada in 1949. In Montreal, John worked in the scientific research department of Canadair Bombardier helping to design and build airplanes.

In 1963 he thought is was time for a change and arrived in Fort Simpson to resume his teaching career. If Montreal to Fort Simpson wasn't drastic enough, in 1964 John taught for one year in Jean Marie River before returning to Fort Simpson in 1965. That's where he met and married his wife, Marilyn, and their first child, Sharla, was born.

John was a guidance counsellor for many years at the Diamond Jenness Secondary School in Hay River. An inordinate number of students sought guidance counselling in his office. It was later found out that John allowed his students to smoke in his office.

John will be greatly missed by his wife, Marilyn, who was an educator in Hay River for many years as well; his daughter, Sharla, who many will know through her work in our government with Health and Social Services; his son, J.J., and J.J.'s wife, Maureen, and his grandson, Alex.

John Carroll was a man of extraordinary kindness, patience and courage. He faced numerous hardships with his health in recent years, but took each challenge with a cheerful heart. He didn't let his confinement to a wheelchair stop him, as he would be often seen going about his day in his motorized scooter. He was a cherished member of the ROT Society in Hay River -- the Retired Old Teachers Society -- a society that which non-members only wonder about, but seems to have a large following.

Today I want to recognize John Carroll's commitment to Hay River, to the North, and to the many students that he helped along the way. The North was blessed to know him. His family, friends and neighbours will greatly miss him. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Passing Of John Carroll

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1384

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Nunakput , Mr. Pokiak .

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Acknowledgement Of The Achievements Of Nunakput Residents

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1384

Calvin Pokiak

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Parents and teachers play an important

part in encouraging our children to attend and stay in school because we, as parents, know getting an education today will play an important

part in today's society.

Mr. Speaker, recently, the Inuvik Regional Science Fair was held on February 25th in Inuvik, Northwest Territories. I would like to report that students from Mangilaluk School in Tuktoyaktuk did very well at the regional science fair. Of important note is the senior category, Ryland Anderson and Ryan Walker won first place in their project called "Meatless for a Month." Maybe this project had to do with the decline of the caribou herd in the Beaufort-Delta region. These two students became vegetarians for one

month, which is rare in our culture because we need the wild meat to survive in today's society. Mr. Walker and Mr. Anderson will be travelling to a regional competition in Truro, Nova Scotia, in May of this year.

---Applause

Mr. Speaker, Bradley Felix and Morris Nogasak, Jr., won third place in the seniors category for their science project by inventing an ultra-simple hovercraft, which, I understand, was of interest to all students.

And finally, Allan Hillier and James Pokiak won first place in the juniors category for their project "Sticky Science."

Mr. Speaker, I might add that I'm an uncle to two of the students and it makes me proud to see these students excel and do well in school.

Mr. Speaker, as I indicated, teachers also play an important role in our education system. I am proud to say that Mary Kathleen Connelly, principal of Inualthuyak School in Sachs Harbour, has won the Outstanding Principal Award. This award recognizes the extraordinary contributions of principals who have made a measurable difference in the lives of their students. Mr. Speaker, during our pre-budget consultations in Sachs Harbour, I understand that Ms. Sandy Lee of Range Lake was a student of Ms. Mary Kathleen Connelly.

---Applause

Oh, how time flies.

In closing, once again I would like to congratulate all the students, their parents and teachers to keep up the good work. And to the students: Stay in school. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Acknowledgement Of The Achievements Of Nunakput Residents

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1385

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Pokiak . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes , Mr. McLeod.

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Compensation For GNWT Public Servants

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1385

Robert C. McLeod

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, lately I've been looking through the newspapers and I look at the job ads. There are some ads that I see in there, Mr. Speaker, that cause me a great deal of concern. I'm not looking for a job.

---Laughter

I'm trying to find jobs for you guys.

---Laughter

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Compensation For GNWT Public Servants

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1385

Some Hon. Members

Ohhh! Way to go. Hear! Hear!

---Applause

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Compensation For GNWT Public Servants

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1385

Robert C. McLeod

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Some job ads in there, Mr. Speaker, cause me a great deal of concern. I was looking at one there where they were looking for apprentices in one of the communities. I am one of the biggest supporters of apprentices in the Northwest Territories and I do think we have probably one of the strongest apprenticeship programs in Canada. But there were a couple of things that made me look twice at it; it's the rate of pay that we pay these apprenticeships.

I was looking at one where they get $16.67 an hour and one they get $17 an hour, and I know they are first year apprentices, but I can remember back in the early '80s being an apprentice and we were getting almost as much as they're getting now. We have to be able to compete with the private industry to recruit and retain good quality employees.

I know the apprentices are working towards the end product, which is becoming a journeyman and, hopefully, getting a journeyman wage, but then I also saw another ad where a journeyman was getting $27 an hour, a journeyman electrician getting $27 an hour in the government system. Mr. Speaker, they go to private industry and they get a lot more than that. There are so many ads I see in there, Mr. Speaker.

Another one that always caused me a great deal of concern was the money that we paid for our nurses. I see one for $34.52 for an acute care nurse and I see other ads where they're paying a lot more money than that. Mr.

Speaker, I'm not disputing and I've never disputed the importance of the work that people do, but we ask a lot of people to go out, get the training, especially with the nurses where they work long hours, we ask them to go and get the education and then we don't pay them accordingly and then we sit here and we wonder why they're all moving South and coming back as agency nurses or finding better paying jobs. Mr. Speaker, I think it's time we have to have a close look at this and start paying people what we think they're worth. Thank you very much.

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Compensation For GNWT Public Servants

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1385

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Members' statements. The honourable Member for the Sahtu , Mr. Yakeleya .

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Acknowledgement Of The Achievements Of Sahtu Residents

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1385

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

Mr. Speaker, the Northwest Territories recognizes several people a year, sometimes throughout the month. We recognize people for their accomplishments and last night I was privy to an award given to a number of my constituents, the Status of Women of Council, Native Women's Council, of an award, a wise woman from my community, from the Sahtu region, as other Members from their constituencies also had this honour to recognize their wise women in the North here.

The Arctic Energy Alliance also recognized contributions that had been made in the North in terms of the awareness and their contributions to eliminate the high cost of fuel consumption being used and the methods they use...

---Applause

...and also some Members spoke in terms of what they're doing personally. So this North is full of action and people who are doing creative things. I want to say that we're not shy of what we can do to do our

part in the Northwest Territories.

Mr. Speaker, also I received a newsletter from ITI listing a young man of 81 in my region who has been awarded for his way of life, which is trapping. It's Mr. David Yallee, who's 81 years old. He's still traps today, as many people do in our small communities. They still go out and do it;

they just do what they have to do. It also talks about a young man here in Colville Lake who was awarded for his high sales in trapping.

So, Mr. Speaker, the future is in our hands so all these types of things that we do, we do it for our own good. I want to suggest a challenge to our Premier here that maybe we should drop another award here, an award for handling competition. Maybe we should have the Premier and his staff and Members here, maybe Members...(inaudible)...a hand game competition with the federal government and really, really have a good day to say the future is really in our hands in terms of what we want to do. Let's have a hand game with the federal government and I think then we can truly say the future is in our hands, and we will win.

---Applause

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Acknowledgement Of The Achievements Of Sahtu Residents

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Range Lake , Ms. Lee .

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Concerns Regarding The Workers' Compensation Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as you are very well aware, we had quite an extensive debate in this House on Wednesday this week on the WCB's response, or inadequate response, to the AOC report and motions directing WCB to take some actions on very specific issues for the injured workers. This was an unusual appearance of WCB witnesses here made necessary in order for the Legislature to express, once again, to WCB that they have much room to improve and that they must do it now and if they don't, we will legislate the necessary improvements ourselves with the upcoming bill.

Mr. Speaker, yesterday in my inbox I received an e-mail from one of the staff who was witness, asking me to give names of the individuals involved at WCB I was talking about, and by extension, the workers, so that he could investigate and take necessary disciplinary actions. Ironically, in my same inbox I received an e-mail from an injured worker asking me why WCB is saying he's only entitled to 50 percent when if he's entitled to benefits he should get 100 percent of what he's entitled to.

Mr. Speaker, I have to tell you that if our past experience was different from what it has been, I may be willing to give this e-mail the benefit of doubt that WCB have a goodwill and workers' interests at heart, but I regret to say I cannot; not when I have seen myself e-mails where workers were punished for speaking to MLAs and seeking assistance; not when we have to call on the office of the Auditor General of Canada to force the WCB to understand something very basic, that they are a legislated public institution accountable to the public, the workers and the ratepayers in the larger communities. Mr.

Speaker, not when they literally write to us that in order for them to lessen the fortress-like build-up and mentality they need a new physical door. I'm serious, Mr. Speaker. ...(inaudible)...they told us it is hard to have an open-door policy when you have no door, unquote. Mr. Speaker, and apparently they need an entire new building in order to have a door so that they can...

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Concerns Regarding The Workers' Compensation Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Ms. Lee , your time for Member's statement has expired.

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Concerns Regarding The Workers' Compensation Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Mr. Speaker, may I seek unanimous consent to finish my statement?

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Concerns Regarding The Workers' Compensation Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

The Member is seeking unanimous consent to conclude her statement. Are there any nays? There are no nays. You may conclude your statement, Ms. Lee .

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Concerns Regarding The Workers' Compensation Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

Sandy Lee

Range Lake

Mr. Speaker, I have to tell you this is beyond contempt. Mr. Speaker, further, not when they tell us that they don't see any need to work on the timeline for reviews and appeals, and not when they were asked through a motion in this House that they direct the worker's advisor to draw up a proposal to provide assistance to workers who need expert medical and/or legal advice, they tell us that they choose not to do it because they tell us it's not necessary. Well, Mr. Speaker, I say this is absolutely necessary and the duly elected Members of this House will legislate to make it happen if needed.

So I would like to give last advice to the WCB: We continue to seek your cooperation and profound understanding that you are a public institution working for all of the people. Understand that or you will be legislated to this understanding. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

---Applause

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Concerns Regarding The Workers' Compensation Board

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Ms. Lee . Members' statements. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .

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Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1386

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Much of the situation we are facing in Yellowknife with the two school boards can be attributed, to some extent, to the way in which we fund the boards. The more students the board has enrolled, the more funding the board will receive to deliver programs. ECE continues to think of students as commodities. Mr. Speaker, I do not agree. However, if it's the only way to get a message to the Minister, then so be it. Then if ogres can be like onions, students can be like commodities, Mr. Speaker. So students need investment just like commodities and they need stability to make sense.

To illustrate my point, Mr. Speaker, I could draw comparisons to the stock market. Every once in a while there is market disruption, like a fire or school falling off its piles. Until this disruption is dealt with, all other schools will not see any new investment. Every once in a while a new product, or school, comes on the market. Everyone wants one; it has shiny bells and all the whistles. It doesn't matter that there is a perfectly good product or school just down the road; everyone wants the new product until the next one comes along.

Every once in a while a new concept or an idea comes along and soon everyone is copying it or modifying it until the great idea or concept comes along. Every once in a while the government decides it needs to meddle in the market, also known as market disruption, Mr. Speaker. The usual consequences of this is one sector of the market will suffer at the expense of the other. You know, Mr. Speaker, although the stock market has good and bad days, in the long run it is stable and usually corrects itself. The problem with the Minister's solution is that it does not allow the market to correct itself.

We have two strong, excellent school boards, Mr. Speaker, here in Yellowknife. That's a wonderful thing.

What I worry about is the ability of the public system to stay competitive and relevant if it loses one-sixth of its programming space. I'm also concerned with the inability of the Minister to clearly articulate his expectations to both the public and Catholic school board. If his mind was made up that the only situation for the public school board to lease one of their schools to the Catholic school board, he should have told somebody in September; certainly instead of spreading his letter here recently and creating such drama and hysteria as he has done as of late. Mr. Speaker, I will have questions for the Minister at the appropriate time. Thank you.

---Applause

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Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Members' statements. Returns to oral questions. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Premier , Mr. Handley .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'd like to recognize Major Glenda MacKenzie with the Salvation Army and also a resident of Weledeh. Thank you.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . The honourable Member for Yellowknife South , Mr. Bell .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

Brendan Bell

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'd also like to recognize the three folks in the gallery with the Yellowknife Homelessness Coalition: Dennis Marchiori, who works for the city of Yellowknife, and Members will remember his days here helping us in this building; Dayle Handy, who's the homelessness coordinator; and, of course, as Mr. Handley has already indicated, Glenda MacKenzie, with the Salvation. Welcome to the gallery. Thank you.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Bell . Recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I, too, would like to recognize a former classmate, from the class of 1988. there were only 26 of us from St. Pat's that year and it's always nice to see a classmate in the building, in the gallery; and Dennis is also the director of public safety with the City of Yellowknife. Welcome, Dennis, and welcome to the other guests, as well. Mahsi.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I'd like to recognize our two Pages from Whati, Sarah Koe-Simpson and Freda Flunkie, who have been patiently working with us and they've done some hard work for us. Mahsi.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Recognition of visitors in the gallery. The honourable Member for Hay River South , Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River South

Mr. Speaker, I, too, would like to recognize the Pages from Hay River South who have been helping us and working in the Legislature this week; they've done a great job and we really appreciate them: Amy Carroll and Ilona Gyapay.

---Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen . Recognition of visitors in the gallery. I also would like to recognize Dennis Marchiori in the gallery. Dennis is a former employee of the Legislative Assembly and responsible for the implementation of the Human Rights Act. Welcome to the Assembly.

---Applause

Oral questions. The honourable Member for Monfwi, Mr. Lafferty .

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Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1387

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to address my questions to the Minister responsible for Education, Culture and Employment . I understand, through a news report last week, that the Minister is actively considering funding a university in the North. Would the Minister please tell us why he is considering a university in the North when the current college system is underfunded by this government and currently unable to do the work in the regions, especially those isolated communities, that it is mandated to perform? Mahsi.

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Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . The honourable Minister responsible for Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Dent .

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Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1387

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I want to make it clear I never said that we were going to fund a university in the North. I would dearly love to see a university in the North, but if it happens it's going to be sometime down the road. What I did say was that I thought it made sense for us to see if we could get access to the millions and millions of dollars the federal government puts into research for universities by building on what we have through the college system here, not only in the Northwest Territories but in the Yukon and in Nunavut.

I think that, perhaps, by building on those institutions across the three territories, we might have a way to look at accessing some of that federal money to help improve the work that the colleges do.

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Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1387

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1387

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we do have high hopes and big dreams that eventually we will

have a university here in the North, but at the same time I, personally, would like to focus on the small communities. The isolated communities are always left out. Will the Minister commit to working to increase the college budgets to ensure that all adults in the Northwest Territories who do not have post-secondary or secondary education, have the ability to attend a college program and obtain their high school education, especially in those isolated communities? Mahsi.

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Supplementary To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. That is a goal for this government already. It is clearly articulated in the plans that have been stated publicly by Education, Culture and Employment. Our strategic plan sets out the way in which we hope to get there and the college is clearly an important player. I have said many times in this House that I would like to be able to find ways to increase the funding so that we can ensure that in each community there's broader opportunity for post-secondary education than what we have right now. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Again, focusing on the small communities, will the Minister commit to ensuring that where college options do not presently exist in the communities, that adults over 22 years of age will continue to have the option to acquire their secondary schooling by attending local high schools? Mahsi.

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Supplementary To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In one of the initiatives that we were recently approached with by divisional education councils, they asked if ECE would start to fund full-time kindergarten. We discussed how we could find the funding to do that. One of the options that we put forward was to reduce the funding that we offer school boards for those who are 22 years of age and older by half of the amount that we would normally fund the student. The school boards, at the time, agreed that that would be an acceptable way in which to find the monies, in part, to fund kindergarten.

We have found there are some DECs who have asked for some flexibility in implementing that change, and through the 2007-08 school year DECs still have the option of taking the funding for half-day kindergarten or full funding for 22 year olds. We're prepared, if that situation continues, I'm sure, to have discussions in the future about whether or not the DECs would like to continue with that flexibility.

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Further Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Final supplementary, Mr. Lafferty .

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Supplementary To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

Jackson Lafferty

North Slave

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my final question to the Minister. Would the Minister commit to working with myself, the Tlicho Government, Tlicho Community Services Agency and Aurora College to develop a stronger permanent Aurora College presence in our communities, including a regular ongoing delivery of trades programming suitable to prepare people for the work in the resource industries of the North Slave? Mahsi.

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Supplementary To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Lafferty . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This government and the college are always interested in expanding our program offerings into the communities, so I'd be pleased to work with the Member and the communities in his region to see what we can do to strengthen the college. One of the areas in which -- and this ties into the Member's questions -- is that one of the areas that we would like to strengthen, in particular, is the ties between school and college.

I'm looking at, in the future, appointing a member to the board of Aurora College who would come from the ranks of the divisional education council chairs to try and ensure that we have a better linkage between schools and the college. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Question 463-15(5): Post-secondary Educational Opportunities In Small Communities

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Kam Lake , Mr. Ramsay .

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Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are for the Premier and it goes back to the monies that leave the territory each and every year. I shudder to think the millions and millions of dollars, and probably somewhere in the neighbourhood of five or six hundred million, that have left the territory since this government has been in office. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to ask the Premier , there is no doubt that there is a dispute between Ottawa and the Government of the Northwest on resource revenue. Why can't this money be put aside until this dispute is resolved?

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Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Honourable Premier , Mr. Handley .

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Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1388

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have been there on that one and really haven't gotten a positive response at all. The federal government's position is wait until we have resources transferred to us. Mr. Speaker, I don't think there is a dispute with the federal government over resource revenue sharing. In fact, it's very clear from the Expert Panel the federal government set up that recommends 50 percent come to us. What there is, is a lack of clarity from the Prime Minister and his Cabinet about what they are going to do with that report, their own report that recommends 50 percent come to us.

We are not hearing anything. We are not hearing a counteroffer of any sort. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay .

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Supplementary To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to ask the Premier this question and I have asked questions previously with regard to using some of the resource revenue monies to establish a permanent trust fund in the Northwest Territories so future generations can get a dividend off our vast resource riches we have here in our territory. The State of Alaska has one. Each and every year, $900 to $2,200 is paid to each and every person that lives in Alaska. Has the Premier asked the federal government why we can't look at establishment of a permanent trust fund here in the Northwest Territories? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, yes, we have proposed that to the federal government and directly to the Prime Minister, as well as to Minister Prentice. I can't recall exactly, but I believe I had the same discussion with the Minister of Finance .

Mr. Speaker, our long-term interest and our short-term interests are...(inaudible)...with the federal government. It really baffles me why we aren't able to come to some kind of agreement with the federal government on this instead of this silence we are hearing. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Mr. Ramsay .

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Supplementary To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Maybe we should start singing O Canada before our proceedings each and every day. That might be another message to the federal government that this is part of Canada and they should give us a fair deal. I would like to ask the Premier if he could, and I know these discussions have taken place, but for Regular Members on this side of the House we just don't have the evidence. What is the government doing? We are six months away from the end of the life of this government and we want some evidence that these hard questions have been asked to the federal government. I think the Premier should supply the Regular Members of this House with that evidence. Mahsi.

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Supplementary To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there has been a lot done on our side. Let me say that going back to 2001, as I mentioned yesterday, the non-renewable resource development strategy. That one laid out the costs of developing non-renewable resources, where the benefits should be and our whole plan of how we would spend the money. Mr. Speaker, that has been given to Members and so on. Mr. Speaker, there are also infrastructure plans put together on transportation coast to coast to coast and a northern transportation strategy. We have a number of these with other provinces and ourselves.

There is the bridge program. We have a number of years saying to the federal government we are going to be responsible with this. If responsibility is any doubt in their minds, then the Minister of Finance has the work to get the fiscal responsibility policy in place saying people, look, we are responsible, we are big people here, we will look after our money properly.

So there has been a lot that has been done that has been provided to Members. Mr. Speaker, some days I am at a loss what more we can do. Why are we not getting this message through to the federal government in spite of our efforts on all the fronts? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Final supplementary, Mr. Ramsay .

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Supplementary To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

David Ramsay

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think it's virtually important that we do get that message out. This government has had three and a half years to get the message out to Ottawa. We have been standing up in this House since the day I got elected, asking questions about resource revenue sharing and devolution. Like I said, six months from now there is going to be a new government and we are no further ahead in Ottawa. So, Mr. Speaker, what is the Premier 's strategy in the next six months to try to deliver on some of the promises that this government has made to northerners? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, as I have already said on several occasions, negotiations are continuing. Negotiations are happening almost on a weekly basis now. The federal negotiator, as I said, is a tough negotiator but we are going to continue with that.

Mr. Speaker, I have also offered to work with the Members. I hope to hear from you. I will work with committee chairs. Mr. Speaker, I am also in contact with other people who have been, in recent history, through similar kinds of challenges that we face right now to get their expert advice as well. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Question 464-15(5): Resource Royalty Trust Fund

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre , Mr. Hawkins .

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Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1389

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In my Member's statement today, I spoke about schools. Schools are about children, Mr. Speaker. Now when I have expectations for my own children, Mr. Speaker, I communicate the consequences of the actions immediately in a timely way. For example, I asked one monster to stop beating on the other one then and there, rather than wait. So can the Minister explain to me why he took so long to express and communicate his expectations and the consequences of them to the Yellowknife school board at the end of February as

opposed to explaining them in September? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . The honourable Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , Mr. Dent .

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Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In meetings with the facilities committee, I started telling them what I thought they should be looking at as early as May and June. That continued through the summer and into August. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think this decision or this type of discussion certainly is two years overdue. Mr. Speaker, will the Minister be picking up the extra cost if YK 1 decides to lease the school? Will they be picking up the extra costs associated with the bussing, the money spent to date for the planning of the next school year that we have now rendered useless and, further, will they be picking up the cost of the severance packages if staff have to be laid off? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not convinced that there would necessarily be cost for laying off a number of staff. I think that the amount of money that YK 1 could use could be put into programming if they were to reduce some of the duplication in overhead that they have in keeping an extra school open. It's stated in the letter and I have always said to YK 1 that we are prepared to look at reasonable transition costs. We are obviously going to be wiling to discuss those. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Now the new formula defines school boards is to choke one by his new design of funding arrangement. Now, Mr. Speaker, if YK 1 does not give in to the new funding arrangement he has decreed on one school board, not equally across the Northwest Territories, what is the next plan?

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Supplementary To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yesterday, the Member talked about consistency across the Northwest Territories. Yellowknife has a unique situation. We have two public boards in Yellowknife that collect taxes from the public. Most jurisdictions across Canada have gotten away from that. Alberta doesn't allow local boards to collect taxes anymore, nor does Ontario. If we are going to talk about a consistent approach here, maybe we have to talk about removing local taxation ability and funding all boards across the Territories in the same manner. I am wiling to take a look at that.

That would, however, have some impact here because the local boards have been using local taxation as a means to improve the services over and above what can be delivered in other communities. In fact, they have to spend the equivalent of somewhere between 103 and 105 percent of what they would have through the typical formula. So if it's a consistent approach we want for Yellowknife, we can take a look at that. Right now, I agree, Yellowknife is treated differently in our system.

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Further Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Final supplementary, Mr. Hawkins .

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Supplementary To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Robert Hawkins

Yellowknife Centre

I appreciate the Minister not answering the question, Mr. Speaker. This question really was about the fact that if YK 1 decides not to lease or give up a school, he has no school. I would like to hear what happens now. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins . Mr. Dent .

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Further Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Charles Dent

Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. With the letter having gone to YK 1 only last week, it's my intention to leave some time to find out where the situation moves from here. I am quite prepared to meet with parties and have discussions, but I am not going to negotiate here in the House. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Question 465-15(5): Funding For Yellowknife Schools

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Dent . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Tu Nedhe , Mr. Villeneuve .

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Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are to the Premier about the socio-economic impact fund that the federal government had promised to corridor communities along the Mackenzie gas project. In a letter that was addressed to our Premier from the Yellowknives Dene First Nation about the Akaitcho territory, which I will be tabling in the House later. Mr. Speaker, I know the territorial government did offer the non-corridor communities, I think two years ago, about $30,000 per community to do some socio-economic impact assessments in these communities.

Even though I didn't really feel that the $30,000 was really near enough to do any kind of socio-economic work in any communities, especially to do a comprehensive report which is required for the Mackenzie gas project, I want to ask if this government was aware while the socio-economic funding negotiations were going on, why this government didn't advocate for all the regions to be covered under this impact fund accordingly. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1390

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Honourable Premier , Mr. Handley .

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Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think every day we are advocating on behalf of all communities and that's what resource revenue sharing talks are all about, is getting a share that can be divided in a fair way amongst all our communities and people so that everybody benefits. That's what resource revenue sharing is, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not talking about the resource revenue sharing negotiations; I am talking about the $500 million that the federal government has offered to corridor communities. None of that money is available to non-corridor communities. That includes Tlicho and Akaitcho. If we are not going to get any of that money, I know we are well aware that the $500 million is contingent upon pipeline approval, but if the pipeline does go through, what kind of contingency funding do the non-corridor communities have to access to mitigate socio-economic impacts that they are going to feel just as hard as any other community in the NWT? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have done a lot of work on the impacts. We did give money, as the Member mentioned, to communities to look at the impacts. Mr. Speaker, every community, every band council, is free to go and negotiate their own agreement if they want to. They don't have to work it through us, Mr. Speaker. Our focus has been getting a fair share of resource revenues. I think it's time for us to look at a share of the benefits rather than looking at compensation for something that will only take us so far. We are never going to become wealthy looking at compensation.

We have to look at our fair share of the benefits from development. I hope all the leaders across the Territories will work with us on that one. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If the GNWT was at the table to talk about this $500 million to corridor communities to mitigate socio-economic impacts of the pipeline which they were successful in negotiating and this provides a nice cushion of comfort for these corridor communities, I don't dispute the fact that they are going to need it when the pipeline goes through. What do the non-corridor communities have that either this government can present to the federal government...I am sure we all negotiated as one unit to get this $500 million, but unfortunately Akaitcho and Tlicho were excluded. What do they have? If these corridor communities have $500 million, what do we have?

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Supplementary To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, the answer is very clear. Those other communities, particularly the ones in this area here have IBAs. They have impact benefit agreements from the diamond mines. I didn't hear up and down the valley complaining that they weren't getting benefit agreements from the pipelines. They cheered for those who got those impact benefit agreements. We are happy with it and would hope they would be able to achieve the same thing when resource development came to their area. Mr. Speaker, everybody has the right to negotiate those kinds of agreements in resource development in their area.

On top of that, we are negotiating resource revenue sharing and that's money to be spread out equitably for everybody. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Final supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve .

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Supplementary To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

Robert Villeneuve

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not sure where the Premier is going with this, but I just want to make it clear when we are talking about a $600 to $800 million project in one region as opposed to a $10 billion project here in the NWT, I think the impacts...There is a big difference in how the impact is going to be. The diamond mines don't impact the whole NWT in their development, construction and operation, but the Mackenzie gas project is going through five regions and 1,200 kilometres, Mr. Speaker. We aren't talking about just a diamond mine here.

The ripple effect of the Mackenzie gas project is going to be felt right through to Nunavut, I am sure. We don't have any contingency funding for the small communities which people are going to be moving to, living and working and maybe have a social impact there. What do those communities have and what can this government offer to those communities to mitigate those effects? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1391

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The ripple effect of the pipeline happening or not happening is going to affect I would guess all of Canada where they have this extra source of gas. Everybody across Canada, in one way or other, benefits a little bit. But, Mr. Speaker, those along the valley are going to be the most impacted. It's going to impact their social system, it's going to impact their wages, it's going to impact the number of issues they have to deal with, it will impact their schools, training their people. It has a direct impact. It will impact other people as well, but, Mr.

Speaker, we can argue for compensation for everybody throughout the Territories and that will, in my view, only get us so far. We will get a little bit of compensation and it will be something that ends up being almost token for some people. The big win for us is on resource revenue sharing, Mr. Speaker. We need to keep a fair share of that in the North. Most of the resource revenues right now come from the diamond mines. It doesn't come from the proposed pipeline, it comes from

the diamond mines. We need a bit of that to spread out for everybody. The IBAs that were negotiated with the people in the impacted area, it's their money to deal with their socio-economic impact as well as employment and contracting opportunities. That is the way it should be. Mr. Speaker, it is resource revenue sharing that is going to result in everybody benefiting from this. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Question 466-15(5): Mackenzie Gas Project Socio-economic Impact Funding

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Sahtu , Mr. Yakeleya .

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Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

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Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Honourable Premier , Mr. Handley .

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Return To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Mr. Speaker, how the revenues from Norman Wells have been treated is a longstanding issue. The federal government takes the position that they have an equity share in the Norman Wells project, the pipeline and so on, therefore it's their revenue and it shouldn't be considered as part of the package of resource revenues. Our view has been that it is. What they have is an equity position in lieu of taxes. Therefore, it's the same as taxes. We have gone and gotten legal opinions on it that tell us that we are right. The federal government has gone and gotten opinions that say they're right.

We are currently negotiating. The Norman Wells revenue is one of the six items that are being negotiated weekly as I speak. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya .

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Supplementary To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I heard some of our Members talk about moratorium in this issue here. It's a huge word in terms of how the impact is going to be in the Northwest Territories. So we need to have some very careful discussions. I guess my point then, Mr. Speaker, is asking would the Premier , in terms of a strong action plan that would go so far as Danny Williams demonstrated in terms of taking the flags down or Mrs.

Groenewegen talked about taking a bus across the country to, in terms of even my suggestion of having a hand games tournament with the federal government over the resource revenue sharing. I guess I'm looking for the Premier 's leadership and his time within this government that we can do in terms of getting the attention of the federal government that this is a life and death issue here. We're talking about our people here. We're talking about our land, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya . Mr. Handley .

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Further Return To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

Joe Handley

Weledeh

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I've said before, my focus is on our negotiations. As long as we're negotiating, as long as we feel we're making some progress, then I want negotiations to be the focus. If we begin to pull other avenues here and then we may jeopardize the negotiations and I don't think that will get us anything in the short term.

Mr. Speaker, we're pretty small in the Northwest Territories compared to issues across Canada. One MLA, one Senator...or, sorry; one MP, one Senator. We're not big on the federal scheme of things, so we need to have a lot of partners. Mr. Speaker, what we do here is watch very closely. It's watched by industry, it's watched by the federal government much more closely than we realize most days. Everything we say is heard. If we start talking moratoriums, Mr. Speaker, that's heard all through the industry and in Calgary and it's a scary word. It adds to their view of us as being less than credible as we want to be.

So we have to, I think, stick to a course, stay focused, negotiate in good faith, and if that doesn't work, then we've got to do other things, whether it's hand games or an old van down the highway or whatever it may be. But we have to maintain our credibility as a responsible government. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Further Return To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

Thank you, Mr. Handley . Short supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya .

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Supplementary To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

Norman Yakeleya

Sahtu

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, with the $114 million leaving the Northwest Territories in terms of return on investment to the federal government in 2004-2005, the time we finish negotiations we're going to have nothing left. So I'm saying, what is it we need to do that gets an ally such as industry, those allies such as the aboriginal governments? We need to put something in place that shows us that we're getting a return. Members talk about a trust, a heritage trust fund. We have to get something. Again, it's a matter of life or death. This is our land. These are our people. Let's stop being beggars in our own land.

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Supplementary To Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Question 467-15(5): Resource Revenue Sharing Negotiations

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1392

The Speaker

Paul Delorey

I didn't hear a question there, Mr. Yakeleya . Oral questions. The honourable Member for Great Slave , Mr. Braden .

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