Debates of March 3rd, 1998

This is page numbers 1265 - 1297 of the Hansard for the 13th Assembly, 5th Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was communities .

Topics

Members Present

Item 1: Prayer

Territorial Public Service

Appointment Of Nunavut Deputy Minister

Educational Indicators Document

Reflections On Budget Deliberations

The Need To Focus On Division Issues

Budget Related Questions And Motions

Nti Hunter Support Program

Treatment Of Elders

Appreciation To Lutselk'e Hunters

The Need To Focus On Division Issues

Curling Achievements

Yellowknife's Economic Outlook

Reflections On Governance

Workplace Education And Training In Rankin Inlet

Return To Oral Question 228-13(5): Update On Tabling Of Salaries And Benefits

Return To Oral Question 430-13(5): Amending The Workers' Compensation Act

Return To Oral Question 132-13(5): Loss Of Staff Housing Revenue

Return To Oral Question 328-13(5): Termination Benefits For Laid Off Employees

Return To Oral Question 353-13(5): Additional Funding To NWT Development Corporation

Return To Oral Question 424-13(5): Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Project

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Hay Job Evaluation System

Government Review Of Issues Raised

Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Hay And Associates Public Sector Experience

Canadian Departure Tax

Layoff Benefits To Employees

Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 8: Returns To Written Questions

Reply 5-13(5): Mr. Krutko

Tabled Document 73-13(5): Senior Management Employees By Pay Band

Tabled Document 74-13(5): NWT Lending Guidelines, Aurora Fund

(1996) Tabled Document 75-13(5): Achieving Excellence Through Diversity: Affirmative Action In The NWT Public ServiceTabled Document 76-13(5): GNWT Departmental Affirmative Action Reports, February 1998

Extended Adjournment

Return To Oral Question 433-13(5): Aurora Fund Management Guidelines

Item 19: Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Recommendation That Public Accounts Reflect Pay Equity Liabilities

Recommendation To Address Contaminated Sites And Environmental Liabilities

Recommendation That Future Fis Include Interest Calculation Capabilities

Recommendation To Improve Cash Handling Processes

Recommendation To Link The Corporate Business Plan To Year-end Results

Recommendation To Request A Comprehensive Review Of The NWT Housing Corporation By The Auditor General

Implementation Of Public/private Partnership Initiative

Item 20: Report Of Committee Of The Whole

Item 21: Third Reading Of Bills

Item 22: Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Honourable Charles Dent , Mr. Erasmus , Honourable Sam Gargan, Mrs. Groenewegen , Honourable Stephen Kakfwi , Mr. Krutko , Mr. Miltenberger , Honourable Don Morin , Mr. Ningark , Mr. O'Brien , Mr. Ootes , Mr. Picco , Mr. Rabesca , Mr. Steen , Honourable Manitok Thompson , Honourable John Todd .

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Oh, God, may your spirit and guidance be in us as we work for the benefit of all our people, for peace and justice in our land and for the constant recognition of the dignity and aspirations of those whom we serve. Amen.

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Item 1: Prayer

Item 1: Prayer

Page 1265

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Good morning. Orders of the day. Item 2, Ministers' statements. Mr. Morin .

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Minister's Statement 85-13(5): Territorial Public Service

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1265

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as this sitting draws to a close, I would like to express my appreciation for the work of the members of the public service of this government. In the last few years, we have faced unprecedented change and challenge. With cuts to federal transfers, we have had no choice but to downsize, consolidate departments and reduce wages and benefits. We have decentralized and privatized some functions and transferred others to communities and boards. At the same time we have piled more work on fewer staff.

With the creation of two new territories, and the implementation of new structures of government in the west, there are even more challenges on the road ahead. Yet through all of the change and uncertainly, we are surrounded by loyal, dedicated and hard-working staff. People who have and will continue to implement these tough policies and to make the changes work.

I had the opportunity to speak with a few of our managers last week, and I can tell you I was very impressed with their energy and commitment. Energy and commitment that I believe can be found throughout all levels of the public service. I would like to take this opportunity to express my appreciation for the work of all of our employees, to everyone working for community governments and for our boards and corporations. Mr. Speaker, the time has come to stop the erosion of our staff resources. We need our workforce, both in the east and the west, more than ever as we face the challenges ahead.

As Minister Todd stated in his Budget Address at the beginning of this sitting, our staff is our most valuable resource. It is time to provide some stability and certainty to these people.

To that end, I am pleased today to announce that for the remainder of its term, this government plans no more layoffs, either due to division or to department consolidations.

--Applause

Beyond that, we will also continue to try to find alternatives for those who have already been given notice.

We know the future western government will have to be smaller. With the creation of Nunavut, we may need to look at rationalizing some organizational structures. But as much as possible, we plan to do this through ongoing staff turnover, reassignment and voluntary separation.

Again, Mr. Speaker, let me repeat, there will be no more layoffs during the term of this government.

Our staff really is our most valuable resource and this government is committed to taking care of that resource, both for today and for the future. Thank you.

--Applause

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Minister's Statement 85-13(5): Territorial Public Service

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1265

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Ms. Thompson .

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Minister's Statement 86-13(5): Appointment Of Nunavut Deputy Minister

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1265

Manitok Thompson

Aivilik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I rise today to congratulate my regional superintendent, Mr. Mike Ferris, on his recent appointment to the position of deputy minister, Community Government, Housing and Transportation for the Government of Nunavut.

Mr. Ferris has worked for MACA for 19 years, all in the Baffin Region. He is well known for his commitment, hard work and dedication. He has been a key member of the senior management team of MACA and is highly regarded by his colleagues at headquarters and in the region.

Mr. Speaker, I am particularly pleased with Mr. Ferris' appointment because he knows the Inuit and our communities well. He loves the land as we do. He enjoys hunting and fishing, as we do. In his home community of Iqaluit, he is a dedicated volunteer and plays a key role in his church and his community. Mr. Ferris is well known throughout Baffin for his commitment to emergency services. As a person who respects the power of nature and the land, he has always been very responsive to community emergencies whether they are search and rescue, fire response or emergency preparedness planning. He always does his very best to give all the assistance that he can provide.

Mr. Ferris has a well-deserved reputation as a person who works very hard. In a recent News North article, Mr. Ferris was identified for being in his office well into the evening, having put in another 13-hour day. This is typical of his dedication and commitment to getting the job done. I know that Mr. Ferris would be the first to say that any achievements he has made, have been made with the support of his team of excellent staff. I also know that his staff would be the first to acknowledge Mr. Ferris' excellent leadership and management skills.

Mr. Speaker, in closing I would like to say again how proud I am that Mr. Ferris has been chosen to be the deputy minister of the Department of Community Government, Housing and Transportation. I know his colleagues in MACA wish him all the very best in his new position. I invite Members of this House to join me in extending our thanks to Mr. Ferris for a job well done for MACA over the past 19 years, and our warmest congratulations and best wishes for every success in his new position in Nunavut. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Minister's Statement 86-13(5): Appointment Of Nunavut Deputy Minister

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1266

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Mr. Dent .

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Minister's Statement 87-13(5): Educational Indicators Document

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1266

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Good morning. Mr. Speaker, I am pleased today to announce the completion of a document called Towards Excellence. This document includes information that can be used by parents, educators and departmental staff to determine where the Kindergarten to Grade 12 system is doing well, and which areas need improvement. Although the final printing will not be done for a few weeks, I have given advance copies to Members of this Assembly.

Towards Excellence covers 30 indicators. Included are, for example, types of programs offered in communities, the amount of money spent on education, qualifications of educators and the Grade 12 graduation rate. The information in the document is from the 1994-95 school year. The data in this report will provide a baseline against which the progress of our school system will be measured.

A second document, to be released later this year, will update the indicators to the 1996-97 school year and will include additional indicators of student achievement. Education, Culture and Employment is committed to publishing regular updates of Towards Excellence every second year. Similar reports will be published on post-secondary education.

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Minister's Statement 87-13(5): Educational Indicators Document

Item 2: Ministers' Statements

Page 1266

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Mr. Ootes .

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Member's Statement 355-13(5): Reflections On Budget Deliberations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1266

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today marks the end of our session to conclude the last budget for the combined two territories. From now on, there will be two separate budgets. I thought it would be appropriate today for me to recap some of the areas that have been of concern during the last month and a half that we have been sitting. One of the areas that I have dealt with is the economy of Yellowknife in various ways. One area of importance was the downturn in northern mining. I addressed that concern by trying to get the federal government to address the gold reserves in this country.

Canada is made up of many gold mines and yet Canada sold off its reserves. I was interested this morning in hearing a report that former Prime Minister Brian Mulroney is in Europe talking with the bankers there to try and dissuade them from selling off their gold reserves. So that was an interesting commentary I heard this morning. The other issue I had was the splitting of the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs, mainly because I feel that we need a concerted concentration on northern economic development and northern issues.

The Minister does an excellent job, but she is overwhelmed with the Indian Affairs portfolio, and naturally so, and we should congratulate her and compliment her on her efforts there. We also need help here in the north, Mr. Speaker. The other item was the transfer of jobs to the north that are presently within the federal government departments. I was very interested again to hear on the radio this morning that the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs is addressing this issue and they are looking at ways and means by which this can be done. That was an excellent report on my part. Mr.

Speaker, to conclude I would like to take a moment to thank the staff of the Legislative Assembly and the staff of the various departments of the territorial government for being understanding and of great assistance during this session and during our last budget together. Thank you, very much, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 355-13(5): Reflections On Budget Deliberations

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1266

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Miltenberger .

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Member's Statement 356-13(5): The Need To Focus On Division Issues

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1266

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as we are all very well aware and thankfully aware, the budget will be a done deal after today. I just want to state again that the issue now is division. Division, Mr. Speaker, and all issues related to division. As a western MLA, my focus is now going to be almost exclusively on making sure that the west is ready for division, that we are up and running and there is a smooth and seamless transition.

We do have some joint housekeeping sessions left as a joint Assembly where we have to put through legislation and take care of that outstanding business to take us up to division. Very clearly Mr. Speaker, we have to focus on, as we run up to division, the issues related to the economy and social programs giving a clear mandate and recognition that

east and west will be deciding their own fate from here on in. The focus has to be division for the next year and only division as the main driving force for us. The countdown has begun in my opinion. We have lots to do and a long road yet to travel. Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 356-13(5): The Need To Focus On Division Issues

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1267

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger . Members' statements. Mr. Krutko .

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Member's Statement 357-13(5): Budget Related Questions And Motions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1267

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the statement I would like to make today is in regard to ourselves as regular Members of this Legislature where there are times that we ask a lot of questions to the Cabinet and raise a lot of issues that affect our communities on a day-to-day basis. Those questions that we ask, are not questions that we just basically think about. Those questions come from individuals in our communities who call us, fax us and make us aware these concerns are real in the communities.

I made a statement yesterday in the House in regard to the circumstances we find ourselves in a lot of small aboriginal communities, where there is a cycle of violence and death associated with that violence.

As an elected Member to this 13th Assembly, there are a lot of times we have debates and concerns raised in this House about the way government spends its money and the way we feel we have been treated from one community to the next, from the small communities versus larger centres. Those motions and questions that are asked in this House have to be taken seriously and taken in the context that we represent constituents as we are the voice of those people. Through those motions and different concerns we raise, hopefully, we will make it better for the lives of the people we represent in our communities.

Things I speak about I have seen happen in different areas or communities in regard to pilot projects, block funding arrangements with large municipalities, one-time funds for different municipalities.

Most of all, there are certain feelings that I have of the different way, with division coming on, a lot of times the support I get in this House comes from my eastern colleagues. With that, I will be missing that support from the Members from the east. Mr. Speaker, I passed a lot of motions. There are times, especially with Cabinet Members feeling the frustration of motion sickness from this Member of this side of the House.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 357-13(5): Budget Related Questions And Motions

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1267

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Ms. Thompson .

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Member's Statement 358-13(5): Nti Hunter Support Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1267

Manitok Thompson

Aivilik

(Translation) Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will be talking in Inuktitut. I would like to make the statement about the concern that my constituents have voiced about NTI's delivery and monitoring of programs that are leading to inadequate management of Nunavut Land Claim Beneficiary Funds.

Mr. Speaker, the hamlet of Coral Harbour has recently protested the effectiveness of the Hunter Support Program and refused to participate on the selection committee. The constituents of Coral Harbour feel that its $70,000 allocation can be better managed by the community. They believe that these funds can have a broader impact if used to develop hunting related businesses such as snowmobile, ATV rentals, a meat plant for the caribou harvest or a slaughterhouse for butchering meat and drying skins. Business ventures such as these are initiatives from which everyone can benefit as well as create more needed long-term employment. (Translation ends)

The goal of the Hunter Support Program is to assist hunters in maintaining a traditional hunting lifestyle. However, I have a deep concern about the program fully achieving this.

Mr. Speaker, in its current form, the Hunter Support Program is expensive to initiate and deliver and it benefits only a handful of people.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

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Member's Statement 358-13(5): Nti Hunter Support Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1267

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Member for Aivilik is seeking unanimous consent to conclude her statement. Do we have any nays? Ms. Thompson , you have unanimous consent.

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Member's Statement 358-13(5): Nti Hunter Support Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1267

Manitok Thompson

Aivilik

There has also been little or no followup on the past recipients by NTI to evaluate if the equipment purchased under this program is still being used to assist hunters in maintaining a traditional hunting lifestyle. My constituents have reported that the cost of upkeep for snowmobiles and ATVs is beyond what most of the unemployed recipients of the Hunter Support Program can afford. In many cases, if parts cannot be found or purchased, then these new machines will sit unused, be sold or gambled off. Furthermore, some equipment is not even used for hunting purposes. Mr.

Speaker, the current guidelines and implementation methods of the Hunter Support Programs leave NTI with little position to regulate this. This is a wasteful use of valuable resource, which should be managed better.

Mr. Speaker, there does not appear to be any set guidelines that effectively combine the flexibility required to meet the individual needs of each community as well as ensure the integrity of the program to maintain and free of being manipulated and abused.

Mr. Speaker, an effective communication and monitoring process must be established between NTI and the communities. NTI is not actively involved in ensuring the goals of the program are being achieved and that the community allocations are being dispersed fairly, economically and to greatest benefit of each community. As a result, the implementation of this program widely varies from community to community. Mr. Speaker, is it not in the mission statement of NTI, and I quote, "to ensure the greatest possible long-term benefit to Inuit from the agreement in a way which reflects Inuit goals, social, cultural needs and tradition within Canadian society."

Mr. Speaker, I do not believe the Hunter Support Program meets this objective. It has not been developed and implemented to its fullest potential to meet our cultural and traditional needs. The promise of greatest long-term benefits to Inuit will be demonstrated when the funding for this program is managed and spent in a prudent and effective manner.

(Translation) Mr. Speaker, I commend the hamlet of Coral Harbour for voicing its concern about NTI's management of this program. Nunavut is not far away, and now is the time for the beneficiaries to begin questioning the effectiveness of NTI's program and financial management.

Mr. Speaker, I am relieved to hear that the Hunter Support Program is under review. I also urge NTI to re-evaluate all programs to ensure they fully meet the expectations of and the accountability to the Nunavut land claim beneficiaries. (Translation ends)

That Inuit have an opportunity to take

part in this evaluation, because these are the programs that are meant to provide for and serve the interests of all Nunavut beneficiaries. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 358-13(5): Nti Hunter Support Program

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1268

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. O'Brien .

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Member's Statement 359-13(5): Treatment Of Elders

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1268

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, most of the Members in this House would agree that as a group we have implemented many important policies and established a new direction.

In the case of Nunavut, we have followed a model, the model Footprints 2, which will erect a solid foundation and a platform for the future new government.

Mr. Speaker, we have listened to reports of special committees, asked questions, passed bills, ensured the i's are dotted and the t's are crossed. In the meantime, however, I believe it has been far too easy to lose sight of those who should have been upmost in our thoughts, those being the elders in our communities.

As a government, we have to ask ourselves if we have failed our elders. Speaking for myself, Mr. Speaker, I am of the opinion that as long as elder abuse continues to exist in any northern community, we have failed our elders as a government.

When our elders have no choice but to live in over-crowded dwellings, I think we have to ask ourselves as a government, is this fair?

Have we taken the time, have we explored the problems or have we studied the kind of programs that would allow this government to ensure the comfort and welfare of our elders?

Unfortunately, it seems the elders in our society often slip into the shadows of our awareness, when more urgent and better publicized matters seize our attention. It is easy to forget, Mr. Speaker, the hardships our elders endured, the amazing skills they demonstrated just to survive this harsh climate that we now leave outside our homes and workplace.

Mr. Speaker, those very same elders dreamed of some day having their own government, of being able to grow old in comfort, having the right to live in safe surroundings and being treated with dignity and respect.

I would like to applaud the decision cited in Footprints 2, whereby the Government of Nunavut has chosen to observe the rights and privileges of elders by pledging a department for that purpose.

Mr. Speaker, the Department of Culture, Language, Elders and Youth has been designated as one way the Nunavut government will be dedicated to bringing this dream into a reality in making sure that our elders are properly remembered and treated with respect, the respect that they rightfully deserve.

Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 359-13(5): Treatment Of Elders

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1268

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Rabesca .

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Member's Statement 360-13(5): Appreciation To Lutselk'e Hunters

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1268

James Rabesca

North Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, I rise today to thank the Premier and his constituents of Lutselk'e for their generosity and hospitality given to members of my home community. Over the past couple of weeks members from Rae-Edzo travelled by snowmobile to hunt for traditional food, the caribou.

During their stay in Lutselk'e, they had a very successful hunt and also played hand games until the wee hours of the mornings.

It is always good to see our groups visiting each other. Friendships were made and re-established. Common goals were discussed, ideas exchanged and most importantly, communication was strengthened. We all have common goals and ideas to exchange. It is always important to visit and discuss matters with our neighbours.

In closing today, our last day of sitting, I would like to wish everybody in the Northwest Territories and Members of this House an early happy Easter holidays and pleasant journeys.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Member's Statement 360-13(5): Appreciation To Lutselk'e Hunters

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1268

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you, Mr. Rabesca . Members' statements. Mr. Picco .

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Member's Statement 361-13(5): The Need To Focus On Division Issues

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1269

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yesterday, when we completed the last budget of this government before division, many of the Members reflected on the time spent here debating, passing motions and making statements since November, 1995.

In a little more than a year, division will occur. Many challenges lay ahead over the next 12 months. We have to work hard to ensure a smooth transition for the two new governments. Over the next few months, the Nunavut Act Amendments will be introduced in the House of Commons in Ottawa.

The gross expenditure base for the budget allocated by the federal government for both Nunavut and the new Western Territory will be made known. In Nunavut, the new deputy ministers will implement the departmental government infrastructure as outlined in Footprints 2, will be set up for a new Nunavut government.

Division will be the major focus over the next 12 months. Areas like the Power Corporation, the Workers' Compensation Board and division of assets and liabilities will need to be addressed.

Mr. Speaker, I look forward to the challenges over the next 12 months. I also look forward to going home to Iqaluit tomorrow, to see my wife and my three children, meeting with my friends and constituents. I also look forward to Friday, when I have the opportunity to entertain our friend, Mr. John Todd , the Finance Minister for this government in Iqaluit.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 361-13(5): The Need To Focus On Division Issues

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1269

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Erasmus .

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Member's Statement 362-13(5): Curling Achievements

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1269

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today to speak about the fine curling exploits of curlers in the Northwest Territories. The first one I want to offer congratulations to, was the Kelly Kaylo rink from Yellowknife, who recently played in the Canadian Women's Curling Championship, the Scott Tournament of Hearts. They were the only team to beat the eventual winner of the championship. They were also only one win away from a tie-breaker for the playoffs. I believe that is the best a NWT team has ever done, so congratulations to the Kelly Kaylo rink.

The second curling exploits I would like to mention is a little closer to home and that is the government tournament that was held here last weekend in Yellowknife. There were two teams from the Legislative Assembly who were entered. First was the LA1 team, which included Mr. Hamilton, Mr. Todd , Ms. Hilda Camirand and Brian Armstrong. I understand this team had some lovely green jackets that they purchased from Wal-Mart using their own money. They came in 10th place out of 40 teams. They had two wins and one loss. There were several teams with the same record, but using points and tie-breaker, they came in 10th place.

There was another team from the Legislative Assembly, the LA2 short-strokers. On that team was Donna Friesen, Fred Koe, Roy Erasmus and David Krutko , but because Mr. Krutko had to travel, he asked Ray Jones Jr. to take his place. This team, very fortunately, came in second place, with three wins, no losses, and again, there were several teams at 3-0 but with points made, they came in second. I just wanted people to know I had selected a bird feeder for my prize because I wanted to look out at the world every morning and see all the birds flying around and know for sure the world is really going to the birds. Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 362-13(5): Curling Achievements

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1269

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Members' statements. Mr. Dent .

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Member's Statement 363-13(5): Yellowknife's Economic Outlook

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1269

Charles Dent

Yellowknife Frame Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as a Yellowknife MLA, I have been concerned about the local economy, the effect of layoffs due to downsizing, division and low gold prices. I have had a number of constituents tell me how their businesses are struggling. They have seen their house prices falling. In spite of these concerns, Mr. Speaker, most of the people in Yellowknife remain optimistic.

Long-term, most people see a healthy future for Yellowknife and the north, although the short-term may be a bit rocky. We have one diamond mine soon to open and probably more to come. We have many natural resources, so the potential is great. We have seen a number of construction projects recently in Yellowknife and there are definitely more to come.

In the past two and a half years, we have seen this government -- and I thank my Cabinet colleagues -- be fair when it comes to issues that affect Yellowknife. Issues such as the move of DIAND staff north, is a real possibility. Even before the last federal election, most of the Members on Cabinet had talked to Ron Irwin to start the work in order to see that happen.

Mr. Speaker, I often hear the comment from people in Yellowknife, the future looks good. We just need people to feel more confident about the future. In that light, I welcomed the Premier 's statement today. Knowing this government plans no more layoffs can only help restore public confidence in our future. That is an important step, Mr. Speaker.

Now, as Yellowknifers, let us get on with building our future.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 363-13(5): Yellowknife's Economic Outlook

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1269

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mrs. Groenewegen .

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Member's Statement 364-13(5): Reflections On Governance

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1269

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

in the West

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Member's Statement 364-13(5): Reflections On Governance

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1270

Jane Groenewegen

Hay River

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. On this, the last day of session, I can say that this has truly been an interesting last session for me. As the Member for Thebacha has indicated, division is now a priority. It is also an opportune time, Mr. Speaker, to re-evaluate, not just the technical aspects of how our new territories will be run, addressing such things as the number of seats, how legislation will be passed, et cetera. It is also an opportune time to look at the spirit, intent and unwritten rules and standards of how we want to be governed.

Mr. Speaker, I have strong views as to what is going to be acceptable and unacceptable as we create a new government for the west. As I have listened to the frustration of many northerners, these views have been formed.

Mr. Speaker, let us take the next year to put in place processes, checks and balances and mechanisms to ensure our new government will truly match the aspirations and goals of the northerners that we serve.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 364-13(5): Reflections On Governance

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1270

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Mr. Todd .

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Member's Statement 365-13(5): Workplace Education And Training In Rankin Inlet

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1270

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today as MLA for Keewatin Central to speak about the workplace education in Rankin Inlet and across the territories.

The future of the two new territories depends on our ability to work with businesses to create an effective workforce. Workplace education has an important role to play in developing such a workforce.

Basic skills and education on-the-job offers employees the opportunity to upgrade their skills enabling them to move on to better jobs. This leaves openings at the entry level for younger people who want to start up.

Workplace education provides employees with the opportunity to take

part in learner-centres, participate in programs with flexible schedules and work-related content. Due to these benefits, the number of organizations offering workplace education has been rapidly growing in Canada.

We, in the NWT, have taken up the challenge too. With the encouragement and support of my colleague, the Honourable Charles Dent , the Department of Education, Culture and Employment, has provided innovative and successful programs that have been designed to meet the needs of our distinct northern peoples and workplace.

My home community of Rankin Inlet has played a leadership role in the successful development of such programs. In November, Linda Pemik, a community adult educator with the Nunavut Arctic College, along with instructors Mariah Aliyak and Janet Onalik travelled to Toronto to make a presentation at a national forum on workplace education. Their presentation was very well attended and much applauded. Many people attending looked to our northern educators as a resource for setting up their own community-based programs.

Successful basic skills training initiatives in the workplace are based on successful partnerships in all sectors, business, labour, government and education service providers. I would like to take this opportunity to congratulate the educators in Rankin Inlet, my honourable colleague, Charles Dent and his department for their efforts to date, in making these partnership in my community work and to encourage them to do more in the future.

Thank you.

--Applause

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Member's Statement 365-13(5): Workplace Education And Training In Rankin Inlet

Item 3: Members' Statements

Page 1270

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Members' statements. Item 4, returns to oral questions. Mr. Morin .

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Return To Oral Question 228-13(5): Update On Tabling Of Salaries And Benefits

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1270

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have a return to an oral question asked by Mr. Picco on February 5th. Mr. Ootes will be interested as well. Update on tabling salaries and benefits:

On May 13, 1996, the Assembly approved a motion directing the Executive Council to consider introducing legislation that would require public disclosure of salaries and benefits paid to public service employees receiving pay of more than $100,000 per year.

I made a commitment on February 5, 1998, to provide information to the House. Mr. Speaker, on February 5th, I also stated that the government is waiting for a legal opinion from the Department of Justice. The opinion was requested to determine if the release of such detailed salary and benefit information would be considered appropriate under the Access to Information and Protection of Privacy Act. I wish to clarify that the department of Justice was asked for a legal opinion on October 16, 1997, and one was provided the following day, October 17, 1997.

The opinion indicated that the release of specific salary information would be an unreasonable invasion of privacy under the act. Given that opinion, staff reviewed different options that could be used to provide Members with some information without breaking the law.

As a result, Mr. Speaker, I am pleased to report that later today, the chairman of the Financial Management Board will be tabling a document that provides Members with salary range information available for public release under the act. Thank you.

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Return To Oral Question 228-13(5): Update On Tabling Of Salaries And Benefits

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1271

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Returns to oral questions. Mr. Todd .

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Return To Oral Question 430-13(5): Amending The Workers' Compensation Act

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1271

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have several returns to oral questions and I hope my colleagues will bear with me.

Return to oral question asked by Mr. Henry on February 24, 1998, regarding amending the Workers' Compensation Act.

Mr. Henry asked whether I am prepared to bring before this house, amendments to the NWT Workers' Compensation Act.

My colleague's concerns, particularly with the subsection concerning subrogation, are not new.

In his 1993 review of workers' compensation in the NWT, chief commissioner Garnet Garven recommended that this particular subsection 14(4), should be removed, and the balance of the

section reworded to reflect the protection of all employers and their workers covered by the act.

As Minister responsible for the Workers' Compensation Board, I echoed this recommendation in the Legislative Action Paper submitted to this House that same year, 1993. It concluded that the approach used by most other boards in Canada where no action is allowed against any employer or worker covered under the system, was the most appropriate.

The staff of the NWT Workers' Compensation Board began a comprehensive internal review in 1994. It concluded in May, 1995, with a draft bill, that among other changes, abolished subsection 12(4).

We made a commitment to table this bill in the fall of 1996. Unfortunately, we were overtaken by the process of division. Soon after, this House removed the WCB's proposal from its Legislative Agenda.

The Workers' Compensation Board has, in fact, worked very hard to accomplish the change suggested by my honourable colleague. As we are all aware, however, the overriding issues of division and other Legislative priorities have resulted in a full Legislative Agenda ever since.

If I may, Mr. Speaker.

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Return To Oral Question 132-13(5): Loss Of Staff Housing Revenue

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1271

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Asked by Mr. Roland on January 28, 1998, with respect to the loss of staff housing revenue.

The honourable MLA from Inuvik asked a question regarding the loss of revenue to the Inuvik regional health board, due to their inability to collect rent from its staff.

I am pleased to be able to report that, in fact, there has been no net loss to the government. The decision to remove the government from the role of landlord to its employees has resulted in a positive financial impact. Revenue that traditionally had been collected from employees living in staff housing was always far less than the cost of providing this housing. In the case of Inuvik, as elsewhere, one time revenue was realized from the sale of owned units and savings were realized as a result of the government no longer being responsible for maintaining and paying utility costs to these units. Additional savings were realized when unnecessary leases were not renewed on expiry.

The government fully recognizes that the Inuvik regional health board no longer has access to the rents that it had previously retained from its employees who lived in staff housing in the town of Inuvik. For this reason, Supplementary Estimates No. 3 for 1997-98, includes funding to replace this revenue and the FMB has approved an ongoing adjustment to the board's funding.

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Return To Oral Question 328-13(5): Termination Benefits For Laid Off Employees

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1271

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Mr. Speaker, question asked by Mr. Ootes on February 16, 1998, termination benefits for laidoff employees and appeal of termination benefits.

The Government of the Northwest Territories has layoff guidelines in place to provide direction to all departments, boards and agencies. These guidelines are found in

Section 1602 of the Human Resource Manual.

Employees who have been issued lay-off notification have different mechanisms available to grieve their layoff based upon their bargaining unit. The mechanism available to employees represented by the Union of Northern Workers is in accordance with

Article 37, Adjustments of Disputes, in their Collective Agreement. Employees covered by the Northwest Territories Teachers' Association, may grieve in accordance with

Article 21 of their Collective Agreement. Excluded employees who have a complaint about their layoff may take advantage of the grievance process as outlined in the Excluded Employee's Handbook.

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Return To Oral Question 353-13(5): Additional Funding To NWT Development Corporation

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1271

John Todd

Keewatin Central

One last return to oral question, Mr. Speaker, and honourable Members, asked by Mr. Picco . Additional funding to the NWT Development Corporation.

Mr. Picco on February 17, 1998, asked me to clarify whether the additional $1.2 million funding that was recently approved to the Northwest Territories Development Corporation was approved through a supplementary appropriation.

The additional contribution to the Development Corporation was approved by the Financial Management Board, but was not voted as a supplementary appropriation.

Under the Financial Administration Act, the FMB is authorized to transfer funds among activities, although the Legislative Assembly must approve transfers between departments, and between votes.

The FMB has delegated to Ministers the authority to make budget adjustments between activities within their departments. However, in accordance with the Expenditure Management Plan approved by the FMB earlier in the term of this government, Ministers are required to provide the board with monthly reports on surpluses and shortfalls. If circumstances warrant, the FMB can then take corrective action. This may include recommending a transfer of funds between departments for inclusion in a supplementary appropriation.

After the unusually low level of forest fire activity during the 1997 season, the Minister for Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development identified an anticipated surplus in the fire suppression budget and proposed some internal reallocations. The Minister for RWED also sought the board's approval of a proposed one-time enhancement to the Development Corporation's contribution funding, to enable the corporation to make additional investments in projects with job creation potential in level 2 and 3 communities.

The increase to the Development Corporation contribution did not require approval through the supplementary appropriation as it did not involve a transfer of funds between votes or between departments. Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker and colleagues.

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Return To Oral Question 353-13(5): Additional Funding To NWT Development Corporation

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1272

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Returns to oral question. Ms. Thompson .

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Return To Oral Question 424-13(5): Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Project

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1272

Manitok Thompson

Aivilik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to return an oral question asked by Mr. Barnabas on February 24, 1998. The Arctic Bay sewage lagoon project funding has not been used to purchase a bulldozer for the hamlet. There have always been two budgeted projects. They are the sewage lagoon and a new replacement bulldozer for Arctic Bay.

During capital planning consultations a year ago, the hamlet council identified the need for a new replacement bulldozer, as it was a critical piece of equipment needed for the sewage lagoon project to proceed. At that time, there was no local contractor with bulldozer equipment in Arctic Bay. In addition, the hamlet's 1980, 814 cat wheel dozer had been in service for 18 years and was in need of replacement. The replacement of the bulldozer is part of MACA's Mobile Equipment Program.

The capital plan included $210,000 for 1998-99 to purchase a new replacement bulldozer and bring it into Arctic Bay during sealift season this coming summer. The new bulldozer has been ordered but because it will not arrive in the community until summer 1998, only a short construction time will remain during late summer and fall. As a result, the budget for construction of the lagoon was delayed to begin 1999-2000.

The mayor of Arctic Bay was advised of this change in the project's budget. Currently, the capital plan for the construction of the sewage lagoon project remains at $750,000 over the three-year period of 1999-2000 to 2001-2002.

In addition, $60,000 is in the capital plan for 1998-99 in order to complete geotechnical investigation and detailed design for the lagoon. Overall, the cost of the project over the four-year period will be $810,000.

The superintendent for the Baffin region will be discussing this project with the hamlet council in more detail and to confirm the timing. Thank you.

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Return To Oral Question 424-13(5): Arctic Bay Sewage Lagoon Project

Item 4: Returns To Oral Questions

Page 1272

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Returns to oral questions. Item 5, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Mr. Ootes .

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1272

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to recognize Mr. Ben McDonald of the Union of Northern Workers, who is back with us this morning. I have not seen his face in the gallery for a couple of weeks. Welcome back to the gallery.

--Applause

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Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Item 5: Recognition Of Visitors In The Gallery

Page 1272

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 6, oral questions. Mr. Miltenberger .

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Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1272

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have raised the issue of this new pay and job evaluation system in this House a number of times in the last couple of weeks. I still continue to get concerns raised and this is my last opportunity to raise this issue in the House until May and in that time I think a lot of things will happen. My question is addressed to the Minister of FMBS.

Initially, I asked about how this system will be communicated to the employees and what will be put in place to deal with any possible discrepancies or glitches that will happen when you try to put into place a very complex system involving thousands of jobs. Could the Minister indicate and update this House on what is happening in regard to addressing concerns that have been raised in this House? Thank you.

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Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1272

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. The Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board . Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1272

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I do have the same concerns that my colleague has, that we ensure that this whole new job evaluation system that is now completed is communicated well to our employees. As I said earlier today, I think somewhere in the region, about 68 percent

of our employees actually get a pay increase based upon their re-evaluated job. There are some jobs obviously that there will be some decrease in that, in terms of the pay levels, but there will be no decrease to the existing employees. I would ask Mr. Voytilla to take extra ordinary steps to ensure that there is a process in place that is transparently clear that employees who are not satisfied or are concerned or require additional information, that we get that in place. I think we have done that. We have communicated in a letter on an individual bases to each employee.

We have set up management committees to discuss the issues with employees. We are in discussions with the union right now about having an extended period of time for appeals. I am fairly confident that we are given this issue its due attention.

I think it is understandable when you are dealing with about 5,000 or 6,000 employees that you are going to have some employees who are not satisfied, obviously. We need to provide, as I said, a clear process for appeals. We are prepared to do that. We will have to re-examine, I am sure, some areas where people are concerned. We are prepared to do that as well. I think the process we have in place and the communication strategy we have in place, I hope, will provide some comfort to our employees, that there is a clear and concise mechanism for them to seek information, to appeal or to raise any concerns they have about the pay job evaluation system that we have put in place. Thank you.

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Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Miltenberger .

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Supplementary To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Initially the information I saw included just the new classification of the positions. On the information that has been provided to staff, has there now been a dollar figure or a salary ranges attached to these job classifications so people can see not only the numbers which by themselves may not mean as much as when they are attached to an actual pay grid? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

John Todd

Keewatin Central

I think as we speak, Mr. Speaker, we are, in fact, providing that information to all of our employees on an individual and collective basis. We now have all the information we require with respect to, for example, a community social worker, who under the old system was at the pay level 21 lets say making $49,000 - $50,000 a year. Under the new system there will be a different pay level in fact they will be paid somewhere between $57,000 - $58,000 a year, which is about a 16 percent increase in salary. All that information will be provided to the individual workers, et cetera.

I am fairly confident that the majority of our workers will be content with this new evaluation system. Hopefully, we can reassure those on the side where their pay or evaluation has downgraded their pay level, that there will be no financial loss whatsoever to those employees. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Miltenberger .

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Supplementary To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could the Minister indicate in terms of communicating this very important issue to the staff and being able to respond, whether the various managers at the regional and community level will be conversant enough with this system to be able to answer a lot of the important questions that I am sure are going to result when people actually get the payroll numbers and all those other issues? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there have been workshops underway with our managers. All the information that I have provided the committee this morning will be provided to our managers and to our employees. As I indicated, I am confident that our managers will have all the information they require to answer the variety of questions that will undoubtedly arise from some of our employees.

I want to say again for the record that I am encouraged with the fact that 68 percent of our employees will see an increase in their take-home pay and in some cases as I have said in response to an earlier question, it is significant. I hope that at the end of the day, we and the union, can come to some agreement so we can put this new money in the hands of our employees in April. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Miltenberger .

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Supplementary To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

Michael Miltenberger

Thebacha

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Understandably with a complex system for thousands of jobs there is going to be some discrepancies and I am sure people are very concerned. The Minister indicated briefly in one of his earlier comments that, in fact, there would be some sort of appeal process or review process. Could the Minister elaborate on this particular key process and possible timeframes that may be associated with that? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1273

John Todd

Keewatin Central

As I said earlier, it is our intention to give this whole process its due. Which means that you cannot do it in a short timeframe and I indicated earlier that there will be a six-month process in place if there is a requirement for concerns and appeals, et cetera. There will be working committees formed. I hope the employee will go to his manager first and raise a concern. Then, he can obviously go

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Further Return To Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Question 481-13(5): Hay Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Krutko .

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Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is to the Premier . It is in regard to my statement. In light of the motions and questions we ask through oral questions, written questions, motions, petitions or motions passed by committees in this legislature and also motions in committee of the whole, I would like to ask the Premier is there some person or persons within the government who take a look at all of these motions or questions asked by Members of this House to ensure that they are fully reviewed and that they are fully implemented.

Whenever there is a budget looked at or there are supplementary appropriations or that there is going to be a change in a program, that they take into account these questions have been asked by the different representatives from the different ridings so they can develop these questions and concerns into any program changes or budget changes in this government?

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Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Premier .

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Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We have done that, in the past, on a number of occasions. We do consider the recommendations of the motions and questions the Members raise in this House. Cabinet and FMB coordinate the information coming out of this House, for example now from this session we will have people working on all the motions, as well as the questions and concerns Members raised and recommendations they make. We will consider those. Thank you.

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Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In regard to the Executive directing the departments to ensure that they take into account these motions have been passed in the House, say the senior people in the departments, the deputy ministers or whoever, to make them aware there are these concerns raised by Members of this House to ensure that they do follow up and it is not just left at the top level, that the senior bureaucrats are also aware of it. What is the process of ensuring that happens?

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Supplementary To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin

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Further Return To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. After the House prorogues, then I will be writing to the Ministers, specifically outlining the motions that are made in this House on the recommendations and asking them to consider it, to look at how it can be implemented, if it can be implemented. We do not know that yet and to give it due consideration. I will be doing that myself. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My next concern in regard to motions is the only real area and opportunity we have for when we review the budget, where we try to give direction to the different departments, in reviewing each department. Motions are made to ensure departments take into account the concerns on a certain segment of the budget. In regard to motions passed in committee of the whole, can the premier tell me exactly how those motions are dealt with by the different departments to ensure they act on those motions?

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Supplementary To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The motions are passed in committee of the whole, usually when the department is presenting their budget. It is a motion of recommendation. I cannot tell the Member what is going to be the department's response. What I will do is track the motions that were made, make the Minister aware, remind him these motions were made, and I would like him to respond to the Member as well as to the committee that he works with.

The committee of the whole is one of the processes, also, when Cabinet Members go in front of committees to review their budgets, at that time, there are usually concerns raised by Members, and we make adjustments at that time. Then we make further adjustments if at all possible. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Krutko .

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Supplementary To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1274

David Krutko

Mackenzie Delta

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My final concern is in regard to petitions where communities make an attempt to voice their opinions through petitions. I believe that is probably the strongest link communities have to this Legislature, is through a petition. One avenue that we have seen are communities sending their petitions in with concerns of certain issues. Can the Premier tell me exactly how petitions are dealt with to ensure that communities concerns are raised, not only through a petition, but ensuring departments follow through on

those petitions?

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Supplementary To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Morin .

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Further Return To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

Don Morin

Tu Nedhe

Mr. Speaker, the strongest link to the Legislative Assembly is not directly through petitions from the community. The strongest link is through the MLA and working with their MLA to solve their problem. The rules of this House, when a petition is tabled in this House, that we have to respond in so many days, I am not sure if it is 90 or 120 days, but all petitions are responded to. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Question 482-13(5): Government Review Of Issues Raised

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. O'Brien .

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Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Minister responsible for FMBS. In reference to the $40 million that has been identified or referred to in the pay equity dispute, Mr. Speaker, I notice this amount is not identified in the budget, not that I can see. My question to the Minister, and I realize this issue is not dealt with yet in its entirety, but once all parties agree, where will the money come from and how will it be facilitated? Thank you.

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Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board , Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. First of all, it is important to point out that up until we did the comprehensive job evaluation analysis by Hay and Associates, we really, quite frankly, were not in a position to have a defendable, accurate costing of what we thought pay equity would cost, both on the retroactivity side and on the ongoing side. It is important to point out it is $25 million on the retroactivity side and $9 million on the ongoing side, so you are talking $34 million. The other $6 million is hopefully for the bargaining currently underway.

The question was, where are we going to find the money? That is a good question. Show me the money. I believe we can work hard through frugal fiscal management of government's resources to be able to find it. It will be a difficult task to find additional dollars that are available. We may have to, for example, reduce the supplementary appropriation assignment that we do on an annual basis. It is down to $25 million now. We used to be $45 million. It is going to take a lot of hard work and take a lot of creativity on my colleagues' and my part, in managing the government's fiscal resources to find the money.

With determined effort and the cooperation of our partners in this process, the UNW, which I am consistently extending a hand to, we will be able to accomplish that. Certainly, there is a sincere desire on my part, as the Finance Minister , to conclude this difficult pay equity issue prior to division on April 1, 1999.

It will take a bit of careful management of government spending, some creativity in the supplementaries and hopefully, we will be able to bring about a resolution to this long-outstanding program and at the same time, ensure that it does not affect the programs and services of the people we represent. Thank you.

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Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. O'Brien .

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Supplementary To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, is there a possibility we will have to cut programs, staff and cap, in order to achieve this amount of money?

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Supplementary To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

John Todd

Keewatin Central

I, certainly, as the Finance Minister and my colleague, Mr. Dent , spoke about earlier, all our Cabinet colleagues applauded the Premier this morning for his statement, making it clear and unequivocal that there will be no more layoffs to GNWT employees until the end of this government. This is the important statement I wanted to read.

--Applause

If we can reach a settlement based upon what we think is fair and reasonable, based upon the Hay and Associates analysis, I believe we can manage our way to paying for these expenditures without any additional cuts or layoffs as the Premier said, to the current budget. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. O'Brien .

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Supplementary To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate the comments the Minister made. He still did not indicate where we might get this money, if it is not from capital, programs, jobs or staff. Can you give me an example of where the bulk of it may come from? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1275

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Frankly, Mr. Speaker, it will have to come out of what I call the supplementary appropriation additional expenditures for government. We will have to manage government even more tightly than we currently have, for us to be able to meet those fiscal requirements should we come to an agreement on pay equity. I am saying clearly here, backing up the Premier 's statement, there will be no additional layoffs in this government. With prudent fiscal management of our programs, we can find a way to pay the $25 million on the retroactivity side and the $9 million on the ongoing side. What we cannot do, is pay any more. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. O'Brien .

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Supplementary To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

Kevin O'Brien

Kivallivik

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. With all due respect, Mr. Todd , I am still waiting for an answer as to where it may come from, what area, in general terms?

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Further Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

John Todd

Keewatin Central

It will come from the overall fiscal expenditures of government and as I said, a little more prudent management, if in fact we can do that, because we have squeezed the budget fairly tight these last two years, and it would be fair to say that. I am confident that through some prudent fiscal management we can pay the bill assuming that we can get an agreement in place with our partners in the UNW, get on with resolving this issue and putting some additional dollars into the hands of our employees by April 1. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Question 483-13(5): Funding The Pay Equity Resolution

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Ootes .

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Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board . I just have a question in response to his return to the oral question asked by Mr. Henry the other day and Mr. Erasmus . Regarding the change to the Workers' Compensation Act and this

Section 12(4), I quite understand that a large comprehensive review is done and substantial changes need to be made to the bill. The Workers' Compensation Board worked very hard to accomplish this particular change as well. Can the Minister tell me what the difficulty might be in addressing that particular portion of the bill alone? Thank you.

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Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board , Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I did have a number of conversations with the Government Operations Committee on this issue, and as my honourable colleague did indicate, Mr. Erasmus and Mr. Henry , have been discussing this at some length with me. I suppose there is no difficulty in bringing forward a minor amendment if we thought that was an appropriate course of action. I did indicate to Mr. Henry earlier last week and to Mr. Erasmus privately, that I would discuss this matter with the new chairperson, Ms. Joanne Deneron, later next week. I am not saying we cannot do that.

In an ideal world, I would have liked to have seen a comprehensive change to the legislation in the Workers' Compensation Board which has not taken place for years. All the work, in fact, was done as I indicated in the return to oral questions, in 1993, 1994, 1995. I would ask my colleague to give me the opportunity to discuss the matter with the chairperson, Ms. Joanne Deneron, and I will certainly keep her appraised, as I would Mr. Erasmus and Mr. Henry , on the issue. Thank you.

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Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you. We do appreciate the Minister's concern and we do understand that the bill itself would have taken a significant amount of time and work of Members of this Legislative Assembly and the Legislative Assembly itself. I did not catch if the Minister said he would be meeting with Ms. Deneron in the next week, did he say? I am sorry. I did not catch that, Mr. Speaker. Could he indicate when he might be meeting with Ms. Deneron? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

John Todd

Keewatin Central

I am not sure. I will have to communicate with her. As I said to an earlier question, this week, I intend to discuss the matter with the chairperson and see if both, herself and the board, feel it would be appropriate to move forward this one amendment. By saying that, I am not suggesting we are going to, I am merely suggesting that I will take up the cause raised by the three Members I previously mentioned and will report back to them by letter as soon as I have had the opportunity to meet Ms. Deneron, which hopefully, will be sometime next week.

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Further Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Ootes .

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Supplementary To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

Jake Ootes

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could the Minister, since we are dealing with the Workers' Compensation Act, look at the possibility of what complications might be encouraged in changing the YMIR, if that is justified? My understanding is that would only require small changes. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1276

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Well, I am never sure, as a Minister, what you are supposed to speak on these issues but speaking personally, I would like to see the YMIR change where the responsibility lies for it with the board of directors rather than coming for Legislative approval all the time. I will address that issue with Ms. Deneron as well. I would hope it does not become another issue, another issue and another issue. Otherwise, we are into a full review. I would suggest to my colleague, given the time left, I just do not see how we can it on the Legislative agenda.

I wish we could but I would certainly address the YMIR issue, which is important to injured workers and the issue of the legislative

change necessary in the relationship to subsection 12(4) and report back in writing to my colleagues. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Mr. Picco .

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Further Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, just following up on some questions on pay equity. Mr. Speaker, if the UNW, as Mr. Todd just referred to Mark Partners representing the employees of this government do not agree that the new pay system is not gender neutral, who would receive such a complaint? How would that be handled? Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Question 484-13(5): Workers' Compensation Act Amendment

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

I am sorry, Mr. Picco , your question is out of order. It is hypothetical. Mr. Picco , would you like to rephrase your question?

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Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I will rephrase my question. Is there a mechanism in place to address any concerns between our partners, the UNW, and the government if they do not agree on the implementation of the gender neutral job classification system? Thank you.

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Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister of Finance , Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, of course, I am working on the assumption in negotiations that we can agree. I certainly hope we can. It would certainly be in the best interest of our employees and their membership. If we cannot come to an agreement, I would think that if negotiations breakdown, then the alternative is to go to the Human Rights Commission.

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Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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Supplementary To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Human Rights Commission, is that the same group whom the GNWT lost a complaint against the last time, that put us in the position now where we have to negotiate a settlement because of a court order. Is that the same group? Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

John Todd

Keewatin Central

I know it is the last day of session but my honourable colleague knows full-well that it is the same group. It is a nice tie.

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Further Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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Supplementary To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, following up on the question concerning the gender neutral job classification system. Mr. Todd had mentioned about the group who put this together, the Hay Plan Group, and has stated that, indeed, these people are recognized in their field. Did the Government of the Northwest Territories use completely the Hay Plan gender neutral job classification system or have we adapted it for our needs? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Supplementary To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

John Todd

Keewatin Central

We asked the Hay and Associates, who is a well-recognized Canadian firm both in the private and public sector, to provide us with a job-by-job classification. That is what we did. Thank you.

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Further Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Oral questions. Final supplementary, Mr. Picco .

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Supplementary To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

Edward Picco

Iqaluit

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Hay Groups has gone into other jurisdictions and have done different types of classification including gender neutral classification under the pay equity situation and the federal government, right now, is involved in their own complaint. I am wondering if the Minister for FMBS would be able to make available, to this House and to the public, how this evaluation system is actually carried out and how the different job classifications were found to be gender neutral. Thank you.

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Supplementary To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Mr. Todd .

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Further Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

John Todd

Keewatin Central

I would be only too happy, Mr. Speaker, as I did earlier this morning, to offer the Member and committees a briefing on the Hay and Associates for the third time, to the Members so they understand fully how we came about with our job reclassification, et cetera.

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Further Return To Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Question 485-13(5): Disagreement On Job Evaluation System

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

Thank you. Oral questions. Mr. Erasmus .

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Question 486-13(5): Hay And Associates Public Sector Experience

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1277

Roy Erasmus

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question is for the Minister responsible for FMB. Sometime ago, I am not exactly sure how long ago, I had asked the Minister if he could provide us with more information on Hay and Associates as to some of their other clients across Canada, for instance, governments or other public bodies. The Minister did not have that information at the time. Has the Minister had an opportunity to look into this issue on other public bodies and I suppose private as well, that Hay and Associates does work

for? Thank you.

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Question 486-13(5): Hay And Associates Public Sector Experience

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1278

The Speaker

Samuel Gargan

The Minister for the Financial Management Board , Mr. Todd .

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Return To Question 486-13(5): Hay And Associates Public Sector Experience

Question 486-13(5): Hay And Associates Public Sector Experience

Item 6: Oral Questions

Page 1278

John Todd

Keewatin Central

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I did undertake or said I would undertake to provide the Members with a full detailed client base of Hay and Associates. I am prepared to do that. I do know from my briefing notes and my discussions with them, they have done a considerable amount of work for, as I said last week, for the Manitoba government, Ontario Hydro, some libraries in some of the provincial jurisdictions. I have my notes here.

If I may, for my honourable colleagues, they have done some work for the alcohol foundation for Manitoba, the Canadian House of Commons, the library of the Canadian Parliament, Cineplex Odeon, the Halton Board of Education, Markham Hydro, government of Manitoba, Public Insurance Corporation of Manitoba, Mississauga Hydro, Patens and Baldwin, a textile manufacturer, University of Manitoba, Toronto Star and a number of utility companies, et cetera. I could go on and on about the background here.

What I am trying to demonstrate to my colleagues is the diversity of clients that Hay and Associates have dealt with, both in the public and private sector. I think it is significant and I will provide, by letter, to my colleagues a full comprehensive listing of the client base that Hay and Associates have. Thank you.

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