Debates of May 27th, 2020

This is page numbers 825 - 844 of the Hansard for the 19th Assembly, 2nd Session. The original version can be accessed on the Legislative Assembly's website or by contacting the Legislative Assembly Library.

The word of the day was program .

Topics

Oral Questions

Members Present

Prayer

Setting the Stage for the Finalizing Budget 2020

COVID-19 Pandemic Impacts on Small Businesses Operating Outside of the Northwest Territories

Community Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Border Check Point Vehicle Crossing

Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Wage Top-up Program and Minimum Wage

Enforcement of Chief Public Health Officer's Orders in Apartment Buildings

Business Advisory Council and Support for Small Businesses

On-going Issues facing the Northwest Territories

Fort Smith Regional Airport

Lack of Support for Tourism Operators

Guaranteed Basic Income

Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Business Advisory Council

Fort Smith Regional Airport

Enforcement of Chief Public Health Officer's Orders in Apartment Buildings

COVID-19 Pandemic Travel Restrictions and Self-isolation Requirements for Northwest Territories Residents

Tabled Document 100-19(2): Minister of Lands Acceptance Letter for the Northwest Territories Surface Rights Board 2020-2021 Operating Budget Tabled Document 101-19(2): Northwest Territories Surface Rights Board 2020-2021 Budget Tabled Document 102-19(2): Environmental Right Act Annual Report 2019-2020

Tabled Document 103-19(2): Alternatives North "Climate Emergency: Getting the NWT off Diesel"

Tabled Document 104-19(2): The Northwest Territories Public Utilities Board Annual Report for the Year Ending December 31, 2019

Revocation of Appointment of the Honourable Member for Great Slave to the Executive Council

Consideration In Committee Of The Whole Of Bills And Other Matters

Report Of The Committee Of The Whole

Orders Of The Day

Members Present

Hon. Frederick Blake Jr, Mr. Bonnetrouge , Hon. Paulie Chinna , Ms. Cleveland , Hon. Caroline Cochrane , Ms. Green , Mr. Jacobson , Mr. Johnson , Mr. Lafferty , Ms. Martselos , Hon. Katrina Nokleby , Mr. Norn , Mr. O'Reilly , Ms. Semmler , Hon. R.J. Simpson , Mr. Rocky Simpson , Hon. Diane Thom, Hon. Shane Thompson , Hon. Caroline Wawzonek

The House met at 1:32 p.m.

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---Prayer

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Prayer

Prayer

Page 825

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Item 2, Ministers' statements. Minister of Finance .

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Minister's Statement 42-19(2): Setting the Stage for the Finalizing Budget 2020

Ministers' Statements

Page 825

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

When the Legislative Assembly shut down in March due to the COVID health state of emergency, the Government of the Northwest Territories was well into its annual budgeting process. As we continue that discussion, we are also moving forward to other financial matters to be discussed during this sitting of the Legislative Assembly.

The disruptions caused by the COVID-19 pandemic do not change the Government's need to continue providing programs and services. At the same time, we have been responding to the immediate needs of the Northwest Territories economy, communities, businesses, and residents as a result of the health restrictions.

Since the 2020-2021 budget was introduced, the government's fiscal situation has worsened as the COVID-19 pandemic has created declines in own source revenues and increases in expenditures while the government has developed and launched a variety of economic relief packages. The significance of the negative effects of the fiscal framework will be better known as the Emerging Wisely plan is further implemented.

Mr. Speaker, we are fortunate that Canada has provided $23 million in support to the GNWT response that will partially offset costs directly related to COVID-19. Right now, departments are responding to COVID-19 in ways that have not been included in their budgets through existing appropriations. These include the establishment of Emergency Management Operations, which are likely to be ongoing for some time; the roll-out of managed alcohol; check stops at borders; monitoring of incoming air traffic passengers; self-isolation centers in regional centers; and homelessness supports.

The Department of Finance is working with all the departments and public agencies to track all of the incremental costs related to the COVID-19 pandemic. So far, the Government of the Northwest Territories has spent almost $7.9 million in COVID-related costs, and we project an additional $31.1 million will be needed, of which $11.3 million is allocated to the health response.

The Government of the Northwest Territories has also provided targeted assistance to various sectors in the territory including funding for childcare providers, airport landing fee holidays, airport lease fee holidays, and increased income assistance which to date totals over $30 million.

I believe we must work continue to work creatively, use further assistance to advance the 19 th Legislative Assembly's mandate. The COVID-19 pandemic and the resulting health measures being implemented across the planet have thrown the global economy into the economic equivalent of a 100-year storm. Given the economic disruption, and despite all immediate government actions to support the economy, things will not be the same when the COVID-19 pandemic health measures have lifted.

The Government of the Northwest Territories has a responsibility to support the recovery as quickly as possible or much of the private sector may simply not have the ability to recover. We need to act quickly and strategically to invest in the future economy and in all of our residents and businesses in a way that reflects the core values held by Northwest Territories residents and builds on the priorities of the 19 th Legislative Assembly.

It is my expectation that, through the structure of the Emerge Stronger dialogue and process, we will be able to gather ideas and proposals that reflect needs from across regions, communities, and sectors in order to take responsive and responsible funding decisions.

Mr. Speaker, departments have provided high-level assessments of COVID-19 impacts on the mandate priorities and associated actions that indicate that a lot of the mandate items can be fulfilled by the end of the 19 th Legislative Assembly with few delays or issues. As we adjust to a post-COVID environment, I look forward to working with all Members to keep the mandate largely aligned with the economic and social recovery by recognizing priorities that may no longer be relevant and embracing new priorities that may have emerged.

As part of the 2020-2021 budgeting process, a fiscal strategy has been presented that spans the life of the 19 th Legislative Assembly. Part of this strategy identified $25 million to fund mandate priorities over the next four years. This funding is proposed to remain in place and the supplementary appropriation to be considered this sitting will include an advancement of immediate funding to begin work on several initiatives.

Mr. Speaker, back in February, I indicated we would hold public discussions on the next budget as soon as possible so that the Assembly would have the benefit of residents' priorities in advance of finalizing the four-year business plans.

These plans and increased program evaluation, among several policy initiatives, are intended to lead to governing so that "the Northwest Territories is a premier destination to live, with a positive economic future; strong educational opportunities for our children; quality health care; a respectful approach to honouring lands, water, and wildlife; and collaborative relationships with Indigenous governments based in a commitment to reconciliation." We want to understand how residents interpret what is essentially our mission statement.

The COVID-19 pandemic has not changed this commitment. Over the summer months of 2020, supported by the Department of Finance, I will endeavour to meaningfully engage with residents of the Northwest Territories to determine their views on a variety of topics related to how and why the Government of the Northwest Territories spends money. Of particular interest to me, given the drastic changes that have taken place as a result of COVID-19, is how residents and stakeholders think the government should change the way we do business and what measured risks they would support the government to take to aid with the economic and social recovery from the COVID-19 pandemic. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Minister's Statement 42-19(2): Setting the Stage for the Finalizing Budget 2020

Ministers' Statements

Page 826

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Ministers' statements. Item 3, Members' statements. Member for Hay River South .

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COVID-19 Pandemic Impacts on Small Businesses Operating Outside of the Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 826

Rocky Simpson

Hay River South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today, I would like to discuss the matter of NWT small businesses conducting cross-border services who may now lose out on contracts due to the fact they are required to self-isolate upon their return.

A real-life example would be a business that currently has a contract to pick up vehicles in the NWT and deliver them to a location in Alberta. The contract this business has is with the southern company. This service is intermittent and requires the business owner, upon his return, to self-isolate in Hay River, while his home base is Fort Simpson. The consequence of this is the loss of 14 days of business and revenue.

The contract is now coming up for renewal, and the NWT company will most likely not be invited to bid. This is due to the fact they are required to self-isolate upon their return and thus not able to follow through with timely service due to the stringent self-isolation requirements in the NWT. The contract will now go to a southern service provider, who is allowed to come into the NWT, retrieve a vehicle, turn around, and go back south with no requirement to self-isolate. This puts our northern businesses at a disadvantage.

This scenario is not only affecting this particular company. It is also affecting other northern companies in similar positions. These homegrown northern companies are now considering moving a good portion of their operation to Alberta in order to keep their businesses afloat. The move to Alberta would remove the requirement to self-isolate in the NWT, which is costing these companies both contracts and loss of revenue.

Mr. Speaker, we all know the reasoning behind the self-isolation requirement, but we also need to use a common-sense approach to some of our decisions.

We in the NWT are fortunate to have some very competent people in our health department, Dr. Kami Kandola being one of them, and I am sure she, with her team and working with other departments, can come up with a solution to this issue and help save some of our small businesses. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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COVID-19 Pandemic Impacts on Small Businesses Operating Outside of the Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 826

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Hay River South . Members' statements. Member for Monfwi .

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Community Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Members' Statements

Page 827

Jackson Lafferty

Monfwi

Masi, Mr. Speaker. Behchoko has issued a temporary ban on all liquor in the community. It was a response to an alarming upsurge in bootlegging. The community prohibition supplements the territorial government's own COVID-19-related liquor restrictions implemented on April 16 th . My understanding is that that prohibition ceases tomorrow, May 28 th .

[Translation] Mr. Speaker, today, we know there have been all sorts of problems and issues in the communities related to drugs and alcohol in most of the communities and my community, because we all know that we have access to travel, and we also know of the bootleggers in the communities. How can we provide services to the community so that we would be able to ban bootleggers? Much later on in the day, I would be able to then ask the Minister of Justice . Thank you, Mr. Speaker. [Translation ends].

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Community Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Members' Statements

Page 827

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Monfwi . Members' statements. Member for Deh Cho .

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Border Check Point Vehicle Crossing

Members' Statements

Page 827

Ronald Bonnetrouge

Deh Cho

Mr. Speaker, the Chief Public Health Officer prohibited all travel into the Northwest Territories to prevent the spread of the coronavirus. This was March 21 st . There were exceptions to allow persons deemed as essential services in and out of the territory, such as long-haul truckers, health and social services providers, federal and territorial wildlife officers, peace officers, forest firefighters, and the list goes on and on.

The Emerging Wisely document, the phased approach to lifting restrictions, was aptly introduced, and phase 1 was in effect in time for the May long weekend. I know many NWT residents were out in full force all over our highway system. This was great to see.

Mr. Speaker, I would like to run some numbers of the vehicle crossings and occupants at the border checkpoint. I believe this was in Enterprise, which is quite the distance from the actual NWT-Alberta border, which is at the 60 th parallel. This information was taken from the Deputy Minister of MACA's report of May 25 th :

On Wednesday, May 20 th , there were 46 transports, 11 private vehicles, with 13 occupants total;

Thursday, May 21 st , 33 transports, 14 private vehicles, with 23 occupants;

Friday, May 22 nd , there were 22 transports, 12 private, with 19 occupants;

Saturday, May 23 rd , 22 transports, 26 private vehicles, with 43 occupants;

Sunday, May 24 th , there were 19 transports, 22 private vehicles, with 43 occupants.

I would also like to note that, on Sunday, May 10 th , which was Mother's Day, there were 57 private vehicles, with a total of 101 occupants. Mr. Speaker, I will have questions for the Premier at the appropriate time. Mahsi.

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Border Check Point Vehicle Crossing

Members' Statements

Page 827

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Deh Cho . Members' statements. Member Nunakput.

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Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Members' Statements

Page 827

Jackie Jacobson

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today, I would like to bring up the MTS sea lift for Nunakput for the 2020 season.

Mr. Speaker, in this House before, I brought up that the sea lift for Nunakput is a vital lifeline in remote coastal communities in my riding. The sea lift gives families the annual chance for lower cost of food, fuel, and building materials shipped into our communities, and also vehicles and snowmobiles. It's more cost effective shipping by sea lift than by air. This is even more important, Mr. Speaker, with the economic impact of COVID-19.

In 2016, Northern Transportation Company Limited was out of business. GNWT purchased the assets, and the Department of Infrastructure took over the company. They started shipping up and down the Mackenzie River. The barges could only reach our communities, Mr. Speaker, when the ice was gone. This means: start the boat, Mr. Speaker, right now. Start getting it ready in regards to our communities and the shipping.

The GNWT has one chance every year to get this job done. Those years, the sailing was a disaster for MTS. It was unable to deliver for Paulatuk. They blamed the high water and the ice blockage, which happens on the ocean side, comes in and out. They are supposed to be resupplying Sachs Harbour. Actually, they are returning from private contracts. That is what was the delay. We can't have that this year.

It cost the former government $3.9 million in flying essential goods to the communities that didn't have salvage season for the residents. Materials and equipment stayed on the boat for a year, and the materials were rotten, mould. The barge had another year to arrive into the community. When the materials did arrive, again, they spoiled on the barge.

Mr. Speaker, Nunakput has not forgotten the 2018 sailing season. I want to repeat that so it reminds the Minister to keep an eye on that, to make sure MTS is on the ball and ready to start shipping north when ice is cleared. This is so important to our constituents up in my riding. The sea lift

schedule is posted on the MTS website. The

schedule of Ulukhaktok, Paulatuk cargo acceptance is July 12 th , Sachs Harbour, August 2 nd to the 14th.

Mr. Speaker, I seek unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

---Unanimous consent granted

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues. Mr. Speaker, Sachs Harbour, Ulukhaktok, their last shipping acceptance date for cargo in Hay River and Tuktoyaktuk is July 12 th . Sachs Harbour is the 2 nd of August to the 14 th . The Ulukhaktok barge is expected between July 29 th and the 16 th . For Paulatuk, the barge is expected between August 6 th and the 19 th . For Tuktoyaktuk, we have the Inuvik-Tuktoyaktuk highway. Plus, we have the shipping for out of Hay River July 10 th , expected July 24 th .

Remaining two barges, last of the year, cargo acceptance for the community of Tuktoyaktuk is July 23 rd for those barges, arriving August 6 th and 10 th , respectively. These dates subject to change, but keep an eye on MTS website. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Members' Statements

Page 828

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Nunakput . Members' statements. Member for Frame Lake .

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Wage Top-up Program and Minimum Wage

Members' Statements

Page 828

Kevin O'Reilly

Frame Lake

Merci, Monsieur le President. To support low-income workers during the pandemic, the Department of Finance has implemented a wage top-up program. NWT workers aged 15 or over and earning less than $18 per hour are eligible. Program covers April 1 to July 31, 2020. Workers who receive commissions or tips must include those amounts as part of their income for the purpose of the program. Students who, as part of their school curriculum, are employed in the work program and those who are self-employed are not eligible.

Employers are required to apply and receive one-time compensation of $50 per eligible employee, and their portion of Canada Pension Plan and Employment Insurance costs for the top-up will also be covered under the program. A grant is paid to each business that successfully applies based on the hours worked for each employee during a given month. The employer is required to include in the employees' paycheque a lump-sum wage to top-up payment in the business's next available payroll cycle. Total cost for the four-month program is estimated at $6.2 million, with the federal government covering $4.74 million or about 75 percent.

To be clear, Mr. Speaker, I support the wage top-up program as it can support many of the service sector workers who provide key programs and services and will assist in economic recovery. However, the need for this program is the clearest sign that our minimum wage is too low. Thirteen dollars and forty-six cents per hour is not enough to get by on, and it is no surprise to many Northerners.

In March 2019, Alternatives North released research reports that calculated each parent in a family of four would have to earn $23.95 hourly in Yellowknife, $24.75 in Hay River, and $23.78 in Inuvik for a decent standard of living.

This government uses a multi-stakeholder process to review the minimum wage. Committee has two government reps, one of whom shares two employee representatives, two from employers, and one from a social agency, two finance employee service consultants. The committee's 2014 and 2018 reports are almost verbatim. The report observed raising the minimum wage will have "little bearing on many Northerners living in poverty because fewer than 1,121,000 workers the NWT make less than $15 an hour." I will have questions later today for the Minister of Finance on how we can keep the wage top-up program as the floor for new NWT minimum wage. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Wage Top-up Program and Minimum Wage

Members' Statements

Page 828

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Frame Lake . Members' statements. Member for Yellowknife Centre .

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Enforcement of Chief Public Health Officer's Orders in Apartment Buildings

Members' Statements

Page 828

Julie Green

Yellowknife Centre

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Today, I am going to talk about issues relating to the enforcement of the Chief Public Health Officer's orders in apartment buildings. I have heard many complaints from constituents about orders not being followed despite the creation of the enforcement task force at the beginning of April.

Mr. Speaker, most of the complaints are about people gathering inside who are not part of the same household. About two-thirds of the constituents in Yellowknife Centre live in apartments and condos, so their neighbours' behaviour has a direct impact on them. Here is a sample of what I heard.

On April 13, one constituent said, "I don't know what's the point in all my email and calls to this GNWT line if no one is actually going to do anything. For the past four days, I've been calling about unit 106. In the past two hours, I've kicked out nine people, and there are people in and out of there every three minutes."

On April 15, another constituent in a different apartment building said, "Why is it okay for the neighbours to have people coming and going non-stop and partying non-stop when we are all facing something bigger than ourselves? This type of negligence shouldn't be tolerated. The amount of traffic has not slowed down here since this illness has began."

These complaints highlight a grey area in enforcement. Landlords, including public housing, seem to be reluctant to stop the parties. Without their say so, bylaw won't go into apartment building for noise complaints. I've been told the RCMP aren't responding to complaints about ignoring the public health orders. That leaves the enforcement task force. On this front, they have been missing in action.

Mr. Speaker, it's my understanding that the enforcement task force has focused on public education about the health orders. That's a good idea since we are all new to this kind of lockdown. But what happens when people ignore and flout the orders? The enforcement task force has access to progressive sanctions for not following the public health orders, but no one in the NWT has received anything more substantial than a written warning. While that action may be adequate in most situations, it is not working in the Yellowknife Centre apartment buildings.

Mr. Speaker, here's why this issue matters: many of my constituents in apartment buildings are vulnerable to this virus because they have pre-existing conditions. They are trying hard to keep themselves safe, but in some cases their neighbours are undermining their efforts. The partiers believe there aren't any consequences, and shockingly, it seems they are right. I will have questions for the MACA Minister . Thank you.

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Enforcement of Chief Public Health Officer's Orders in Apartment Buildings

Members' Statements

Page 829

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Yellowknife Centre . Members' statements. Member for Kam Lake .

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Business Advisory Council and Support for Small Businesses

Members' Statements

Page 829

Caitlin Cleveland

Kam Lake

Mr. Speaker, it has not been lost on me that, had this pandemic occurred a year ago, I would have been amongst those northern business owners facing little option for financial support and the threat of closing my business.

Being a business owner in the North is a challenge. In the wake of this pandemic, our small-to-medium business owners are struggling to keep staff on payroll while incurring close to no billable hours. The federal Canada Emergency Wage Subsidy does not subsidize related employees. This means that, in the North, where so many of us are family, many northern businesses don't qualify. While northern businesses do not have to pay their WSCC premiums today, they are, incurring an eventual debt for staff at home.

On March 20, this government released its first economic relief package. It offered loans through the BDIC, along with freezes to fees and payments owed to the GNWT. On the same day, the GNWT promised the business community a Business Advisory Council to identify gaps in financial supports and to plan how the government could build up our struggling business community. It is now 10 weeks later, Mr. Speaker, and this council still does not exist.

Phase 1 of the GNWT's Emerging Wisely plan is allowing businesses to gradually reopen. Some businesses will find that, because of restrictions for public safety, it actually costs more to operate than the income being generated. Some will find they are cut off from federal supports once they start generating an income, even though that income is not yet at a liveable level.

Mr. Speaker, this fall, a second wave of COVID is expected. Businesses may need to again close their doors, so now is the time to get a plan in place. Around the world, local economies have a vigorous interest in building resilience to shock as they regenerate, a silver lining in the midst of this pandemic, but, to begin building resilience, we need to make it to tomorrow. We didn't start our containment phase willing to lose people to COVID-19. We cannot start our business recovery plan willing to lose long-time northern businesses.

We have seen great innovation from many northern businesses, and I commend them for displaying creativity in chaos, but not every business has the resources or ability to make it on their own. Local business owners have been there to support our sports teams, help when tragedy hits our communities, and offer the services we rely on. They are the backbones of our communities, and now, more than ever, they need our support and the leadership of the GNWT. This government must do more on an urgent basis to help our local businesses.

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Business Advisory Council and Support for Small Businesses

Members' Statements

Page 830

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Kam Lake . Members' statements. Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes .

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On-going Issues facing the Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 830

Lesa Semmler

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. While we as a government deal with the COVID pandemic, it will and is becoming very clear that we will need more resources to address the needs of our residents. People will look to the government to help them during these trying times.

While we face this pandemic and all that it involves, we also have other ongoing issues here in the North. Some of the issues have been called a crisis. I'm speaking of issues like housing; health of our people; the cost of living; our children in care; protection of our vulnerable women and children; infrastructure needs, just in the town of Inuvik alone; and economic development, as just some examples that my constituents bring forward.

Mr. Speaker, while we are not in normal times as a result of the pandemic, unfortunately, some of the other issues that I just mentioned are far too common and normal for my community and for the communities of the North. It's my opinion that these issues of things like housing and our children in care do not need to be considered normal, and we as a government need to do as much as we can to ensure that Canada understands that the issues we face are not normal, but at times in fact are unacceptable.

We must find ways to ensure that the federal government invests not only in normal operational issues, but invests in the resources that we need, as a government, to address these issues we face and what some people consider normal.

I will have questions for the Premier later on how we can better access federal resources to deal with our issues, because the investment dollars that I'm speaking about, just for my community alone, will require a massive federal investment, and that is long overdue. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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On-going Issues facing the Northwest Territories

Members' Statements

Page 830

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes . Members' statements. Member for Thebacha .

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Fort Smith Regional Airport

Members' Statements

Page 830

Frieda Martselos

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, yesterday I delivered my response to the Commissioner's opening address, where I outlined my priorities for the 19 th Assembly. In today's Member's statement, I am going to expand on one of these priorities, the Fort Smith Regional Airport.

In my speech yesterday, I was very clear in what I and the constituents of Thebacha want to see done with the Fort Smith Regional Airport. I will reiterate that what needs to be done is the following:

a new and improved terminal to be built;

the runway to be restored to its original width;

all LED lights to be properly reinstalled and in working order; and

ensure the stakeholders of the town of Fort Smith are properly involved and consulted during the entire process.

Mr. Speaker, one of the key reasons that I decided to run for MLA in the first place was to help rebuild Fort Smith in order to correct errors such as that which was done to our airport. I have spoken about this issue multiple times during this Assembly already, but people don't seem to understand the genuine sentiment that the people of Fort Smith have about this issue. I spoke to many of my constituents about this airport issue since these changes were done, and everybody agrees that Fort Smith was wrong with those changes to the LED lights, some of which don't even work, along with the bizarre decision to reduce the runway width.

All of the constituents of Thebacha want to see better and proper improvements made to our airport. Our community is long overdue for a new airport terminal, given we have been using the same terminal since 1969. Plus, considering the damage done to our economy from COVID-19, this type of infrastructure project is a great opportunity to help spur economic growth within our community, as well as the broader South Slave region and the NWT.

Mr. Speaker, until I start seeing results on this issue, I will continue to bring this issue up and fight for the betterment of Fort Smith. I assure you, as long as I am a Member of this House, this will not be the last time you will hear me talk about this issue. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Fort Smith Regional Airport

Members' Statements

Page 830

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Thebacha . Members' statements. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh .

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Lack of Support for Tourism Operators

Members' Statements

Page 831

Steve Norn

Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Marsi cho, Mr. Speaker. This week is National Tourism Week, from May 24 th to the 31 st of this month, and I wish I could stand here today to celebrate the incredible success of my constituents, the Lutselk'e Dene First Nation, the LKDFN, for their leadership and successful acquisition of the Frontier Fishing Lodge, which has operated for 40 years on the doorstep and has a global reputation as one of the premier fishing lodges in the Northwest Territories, but unfortunately, I can't.

Mr. Speaker, in December 2019, the LKDFN purchased the lodge and the entire business, including the operating company, of all its assets. The community intends the lodge to be the gateway to the Thaidene Nene, drawing tourists from all around the world to discover the beauty of the East Arm and the Dene way of life. They see the lodge as critical infrastructure that will become an economic engine for the community, and one of the primary employers in a village that already suffers from high unemployment.

However, in my opinion, the GNWT is standing in its way. The only thing that has changed is the business ownership, yet the GNWT has required the LKDFN to apply for brand new permits to extend the operation of the lodge. Over the past few months, the LKDFN has sought and obtained the transfer of its tour operator's licence and has obtained conditional health and occupancy permits. In the process of obtaining a remote lodge liquor permit, the LKDFN was advised that it would also require a MACA business licence.

Previously, a lodge required a business licence, as remote lodges until recently had been regulated by ITI under the Tourism Act. However, changes to the liquor regulations now appear to require MACA to issue business licences to remote lodges. After more than two months of unresponsiveness and delay, MACA has informed LKDFN it needs to develop new policies in order to issue the licence. Lutselk'e and the Frontier Lodge are apparently the first remote tour operation subjected to these now policy requirements in obtaining a MACA licence.

Mr. Speaker, instead of granting the LKDFN a temporary exemption to operate while MACA develops these new policies, MACA's Office of the Fire Commissioner has instead advised the LKDFN that it is cancelling the temporary occupancy permits for the lodge that were previously issued. I am seeking unanimous consent to conclude my statement.

---Unanimous consent granted

Marsi cho, colleagues, Mr. Speaker. Simply put, MACA is withholding critical permits from the LKDFN in the middle of a pandemic that is already having a devastating effect on our tourism industry. The effect of this decision is obvious; the lodge cannot open for business, and the LKDFN will have received no revenue. Something has got to give, and I sincerely hope that this does not result in a defunct business in the NWT.

I want to take a quote here from the website for the National Tourism Week. It says, "Tourism matters, and Canada cannot afford to lose another tourism sector." I think I will take that a little bit further. The Northwest Territories cannot afford to lose any of its tourism operators. Marsi cho, Mr. Speaker. I will have questions for the MACA Minister later on.

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Lack of Support for Tourism Operators

Members' Statements

Page 831

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh . Members' statements. Member for Yellowknife North

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Guaranteed Basic Income

Members' Statements

Page 831

Rylund Johnson

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In this House, we have the honour of debating and discussing some of the larger policy ideas. One you will hear me speak about over the next three years is a universal basic income.

Mr. Speaker, I want to reiterate that, despite the fact that I talk about this large, very lofty program that would change the nature of government and society, and it's a program I fundamentally believe in, I don't believe, since we're having that debate, that all other conversations around social assistance programs are just kind of put on hold. One of my concerns is that I recognize that a universal basic income would take, probably, ten years and millions of dollars and require support from the federal government, but that doesn't mean we can't start now. What happens is while we are having that much larger debate, we don't set ourselves up for success in starting small now.

I want to clarify some of the terms that often get thrown around in this world. A universal basic income is the proposal you give everyone money every month. You've seen different jurisdictions do this. It can be $1,000 a month. It can be $3,000 a month. It doesn't matter if you're rich or poor. Such a policy would cost millions of dollars and be a complete transformation on how government operates.

Then, there's a guaranteed basic income, not necessarily universal, which would guarantee an amount of income to every person in the Northwest Territories. What that amount is, is up for debate. It could be $12,000 a year. They could say, no one in the Northwest Territories is going to make less than $12,000 a year, and it doesn't matter if you don't do your proactive step, or you miss your income assistance program. We're just guaranteeing that.

Then, there's a guaranteed livable income which actually kicks that up to an amount so you're not just squaloring away in poverty, say, $36,000 a year.

There are a variety of options, but meanwhile, while we have this debate in this House, I want the Department of Education, Culture and Employment to be picking away at some smaller non-controversial changes. I believe we could start a guaranteed basic income pilot project tomorrow. We could take ten people out of income assistance who have been on it for years. We could guarantee them a liveable income for a year, and it would probably cost us less than a half million dollars to do it, and it might in the long run actually save us some money.

I would like departments to start small, to look at the next smallest policy change they can make that gets us to that bigger picture. I will have questions for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment . Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Guaranteed Basic Income

Members' Statements

Page 832

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North . Members' statements. Item 4, recognition of visitors in the gallery. Item 5, returns to oral question. Item 6, acknowledgements. Item 7, Oral questions. Member for Nunakput .

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

Jackie Jacobson

Nunakput

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Today, I have questions for the Minister of Infrastructure . I would like the Minister to assure that everything is going as planned for the MTS shipping season, the 2020 shipping season, without any delays. Yes or no? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Nunakput . Minister of Infrastructure

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Yes, I can commit that everything is on track with MTS for this upcoming season. We are looking for new ways to provide reliable community resupply and ensure that we are gaining our maximum value. We will have the four double-hulled barges delivered to Tuktoyaktuk. August 12 th or 15 th , it will show up in Tuktoyaktuk. We were the first to be approved under the Oceans Protection Plan on that. This one is a 75/25 percent funding. The seven other projects that we have in under that plan will all be at 100 percent funding. We are looking at the changes.

We are reviewing at the moment the changes that we could be making to MTS and the structure of the organization. We are not at a stage yet where we have determined what that is going to look like, but it is generally viewed that creating a Crown corporation would provide the maximum benefit and flexibility going forward.

A marine business consultant has recently been engaged to review and build upon the previous work and make recommendations of viable options as to the business structure that is best suited for the way that we do business in the North. In addition to the four double-hulled showing up this year, we have the two double-hulled pre-owned barges that we purchased in 2017. We have two new 1500 series conversions. MTS will have a total of eight double-hulled fuel barges. We are looking at new markets. I think I will conclude there. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

Jackie Jacobson

Nunakput

For the cargo acceptance dates, are those finalized at this time on the website, just to make sure that the people have proper notification in regards to ordering their food and their trucks or building materials for the community? Also, with our government purchasing bulk fuel from Edmonton rack price because the prices up there, they only change once a year when the barge comes in. Right now, at the pumps here, 97 cents. Back home, it's $1.51 and it only gets higher, so to try and get cheaper fuel into the communities.

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

Yes, the website is updated, and things are finalized. We do encourage people to continue to check the website regularly as things do change, and if the situation were to change. We are looking at our fuel supply model. That has definitely been something that has been raised with us. We did have a discussion yesterday about that. I believe the Member had to leave. We recognize that we need to look at our model and ensure that it does meet the efficient supply and resupply of the communities. As well, too, to make sure we have some reliability and redundancy within the models. We are definitely evaluating the fuel supply model.

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

Jackie Jacobson

Nunakput

Could I ask the Minister to have a commitment from her in regards to advise us if there's any delays or anything with MTS for the outlying communities, just to make sure that the department stays on top of it? They are our lifeline in our small communities that I represent, and we have to make sure that any potential problems be rectified as soon as possible. Just a commitment from the Minister and her department?

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

Yes. I will commit to that personally and notifying the Member, and the other relevant Members, every time there is a delay in the resupply or any changes.

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Question 233-19(2): Marine Transportation System Shipping Season

Oral Questions

Page 832

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Oral questions, Member for Monfwi .

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Jackson Lafferty

Monfwi

Masi, Mr. Speaker. The enforcement of Behchoko temporary liquor prohibition, Mr. Speaker, the first question I have is for the Minister of Justice . What measures have the RCMP adopted to meet increased law enforcement challenges of the Behchoko temporary ban on liquor? Masi.

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you. Minister of Justice .

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There is always an ongoing dialogue between the Department of Justice and the RCMP, and this dialogue has been particularly keen in the last couple of months. There has been a lot of attention paid to the situation of bootlegging and illicit drug activity across borders. That dialogue continues. Mr. Speaker, I know that, later this session, I expect to be speaking to the police and priorities and would continue to encourage every community to develop their own community police priorities which can also then be a direct link into the activities of the RCMP in their regions.

The RCMP have been, I also believe, particularly active of late in terms of enforcing alcohol and drug measures and have been putting out a number of their own press releases on that front. To that extent, all of that work continues. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Jackson Lafferty

Monfwi

From what I've been hearing from my constituents and in the community of Behchoko is, obviously, there is a lack of enforcement, a lack of officers at the Ray Junction area. I live in Edzo, and I go there, and I haven't seen cops on the road yet. I am hoping that they are enforcing it.

Mr. Speaker, the second question I have is, how many vehicle searches and check stops have the RCMP conducted at the Ray Junction since the introduction of the Behchoko temporary liquor prohibition compared to other jurisdictions as well?

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

We don't necessarily keep detailed track at the Department of Justice about all of the actions of the RCMP. I can certainly commit, for one, to just follow up with the RCMP and determine exactly what statistics they might maintain so that we can ensure that they are provided. Certainly, they do provide reports to every community on a regular basis, but on this specific discussion, we will follow up with them. I can indicate, Mr. Speaker, that between May 19 th and 25 th , Behchoko RCMP did make five seizures of alcohol within the prohibition boundaries.

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Jackson Lafferty

Monfwi

Along with that second question, this is a follow-up. If the Minister can provide that if she doesn't have it with her, along with that consultation with the RCMP. How many charges have the RCMP laid under the Behchoko prohibition order? Masi.

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

Yes. Again, I don't know that the Department of Justice has right now, on track, that specific information, and it may well be that it's held by the RCMP. However, again, what I can do is at least ensure that that question is transmitted to the RCMP directly and see that they can follow up.

As I mentioned, the RCMP does have regular updates they provide to communities, and it's a good opportunity to ensure that, when they are doing that, that they are providing updates to the extent that they have the information about Liquor Act violations, Liquor Act prohibitions, since that certainly has been of significant interest of late.

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Monfwi .

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Jackson Lafferty

Monfwi

Masi, Mr. Speaker. [Translation] Right now, when they put the restriction on liquor, we were told by the RCMP that they were going to help and do the check stop. When this sort of stuff happened within the community, people were trying to help themselves, and the leaders are doing work for the people and also get help from the RCMP to do the check stop, because we all know that the restriction is there and that the RCMP are not there most of the time. Thank you. [Translation ends].

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

Mr. Speaker, I certainly am pleased to be able to say that the Tlicho region will be getting two further officers under the First Nations policing program, so, to the extent that there is a need for greater enforcement by the RCMP, with more manpower in the Tlicho region, that is at least one piece of good news I can give to the Member at this point.

Beyond that, Mr. Speaker, I can also say I have now had several hours of conversation with some of the Indigenous leaders, including some of the chiefs from the Tlicho region, and certainly intend to continue to do so as or when necessary, regarding bootlegging or other matters that may arise in relation to the enforcement of bootlegging. I appreciate that question. Again, it's certainly my hope that, with these two officers, enforcement measures can only continue to be improved upon. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 234-19(2): Temporary Alcohol Restrictions in Behchoko

Oral Questions

Page 833

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Oral questions. Member for Deh Cho .

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Oral Questions

Page 834

Ronald Bonnetrouge

Deh Cho

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My question is related to my Member's statement though on the border check point. For the number of occupants who cross the border, I am certain we could quarantine all of them for 14 days, but that would have stretched the amount of available rooms in the nearby hotels, and the nearest hotels are in Hay River. Can the Premier provide information as to the data collected from the vehicle occupants at the check points? Mahsi.

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Oral Questions

Page 834

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Deh Cho . Honourable Premier .

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Oral Questions

Page 834

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Any person who enters the Northwest Territories and lands at either an airport or on a highway at the check points, the first thing you are asked for is a piece of identification to prove if you are a resident of the Northwest Territories. If you are not a resident of the Northwest Territories, then you are asked to provide a letter from an employer or a proof that you are an essential worker. If you are an essential worker, then we will allow you through because, if you are in the territories for more than 36 hours, you need to have a self-isolation plan.

If you are driving up, like our supply-chain truckers coming, the assumption is they will come to probably Yellowknife, drop off their load, and be back at the border within 36 hours, and so therefore they do not need that. Those are the exceptions for essential workers.

If there is a person from outside the territories who is not an essential worker and not a resident, they automatically have to return, and that is dependent on airlines. There was an incident of a person going into the northern communities, and we did put them up in an isolation unit for the one night until the airline could get back. People who are residents of the Northwest Territories, besides identification, they need to have an isolation plan. If they do not have one, we do give them 24 hours' notice to get one in place. We follow up on that.

At the end of every day, a list of every name that came through is compiled and provided to isolation centres, and, if they are checking into the four regional centres, then we do follow up with them. That is the information.

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Oral Questions

Page 834

Ronald Bonnetrouge

Deh Cho

The amount of crossings by private vehicles is very alarming, considering the Northwest Territories does have a public health emergency and a declared state of emergency during this pandemic. There are news reports of Alberta residents and alleged drug dealers gaining entry into the NWT. Perhaps this is an indication of our lax check point procedures. Does the border check point ask for the identification of all the occupants of private vehicles and transports?

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Oral Questions

Page 834

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

Yes, my understanding is that definitely everyone is asked for their identification. It does not matter if you are driving or riding. However, there is an issue with some things. People are coming up and, from what I have heard, it's not only across the highways or in our airplanes; it's coming from water. Those are things that we are looking at, as well. The bad thing about COVID-19 is what's happening. The good thing about COVID-19 is we are having more checks at the borders, and so we are more conscious of illegal trades that are happening at our borders.

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Oral Questions

Page 834

Ronald Bonnetrouge

Deh Cho

Mahsi for that. It's been about two months since closing our border and providing a check point to screen people and recommend self-isolation. In this time, check point procedures should have paid particular attention to all occupants in the vehicles and tested them for the coronavirus. Every day that I enter this building, I am temperature tested for signs of the fever, and I haven't even crossed the border. Will the Minister commit to providing more stringent controls and enforcement officers to check points in light of this pandemic?

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

Oral Questions

Page 834

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

At this point, I have not heard that having extra staffing at the border controls was an issue. We did know that, with the fire season, some of our public health officers had to go back to their positions in departments. We are actively looking for other recruitments in that area. I would love to be able to say that every person who came across, if we just took their temperature, they would be okay, and they could come in. My worry with doing that, in honesty, Mr. Speaker, is that sometimes people are asymptomatic. Not everybody will have a temperature.

If we start taking that temperature, does that give people the false security that we are okay? That is my biggest worry for this whole summer, is people think that we are in this bubble. We are not in a bubble, Mr. Speaker. We do have gaps in our border, so my worry is about the caution and making sure that people take this seriously.

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Question 235-19(2): Border Checkpoint Vehicle Crossings

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Page 834

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Honourable Premier . Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife North .

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

Oral Questions

Page 834

Rylund Johnson

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I spoke earlier today about a guaranteed basic income, but I would like to start by focusing on what the closest program we have to that in the Northwest Territories is, income assistance. My question for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment is: is our current Income Assistance Program working? Are people actually incentivized to get a job, or is it simply just keeping people in a cycle of poverty? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 834

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North . Minister of Education, Culture and Employment .

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

Oral Questions

Page 835

R.J. Simpson

Hay River North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have said before in this House that we could always do better with every program in the territory, and the Income Assistance Program is one of those. The Member asks whether it's working, and that depends on what exactly people want out of the program. There is a seniors' component where seniors are supported, and we are not trying to incentivize people who have aged out of the workforce to get back to work. There is a program for persons with disabilities who just can't work. We are not trying to incentivize them.

The program is there to help people with their basic needs, and, in that sense, it is working. We make sure that, if there is a home for someone, if someone will rent a home to a person, we will pay for that. If someone can't afford a home but someone is willing to rent to that person, we pay for that, and we will give them money for food, so, in that sense, it's working. Is it a program that is allowing people to get back to work? For some people, it is. There are people I work with who have been on income assistance at a point in their life and have used it as a stepping stone to get further.

With that being said, it's not the program that the Member is describing, one which is doing a very good job at getting people out of poverty. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 835

Rylund Johnson

Yellowknife North

I appreciate that answer from the Minister, and I do recognize that the seniors and disability streams, the goal of those programs is not to get people back into the workforce. I do think, at the heart, both a guaranteed basic income and income assistance's goal is to get people into the workforce, but on their own terms.

I previously asked questions to the Minister regarding looking into a pilot project for a guaranteed basic income, and he said we simply don't have the policy staff. Given we are now in a global pandemic and entering into one of the largest economic recessions of any of our lifetimes, has the Minister's view on that changed?

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 835

R.J. Simpson

Hay River North

We actually have less staff now than we did when the Member asked that questions. There are dozens of employees from ECE who have moved over to Health to help with those efforts. There are employees working from home who are having issues accessing government files, and things like that, so we are in a worst position to do that type of work, especially given what we have.

I appreciate the Member's comments earlier that we could start this program tomorrow, if we wanted. This pandemic has shown that departments can be responsive, and they can move quickly. However, I don't know if we can move that quickly, spending half a million dollars on a program that doesn't exist today that needs to be put into regulations that we need to have metrics on, and things like that.

Since day one, I have been committed to improving the Income Assistance Program. I agree with the Member that we should adapt that program or reform that program so that it does incentivize getting people to work, and that is not an easy task. It's not as easy as giving people $36,000 a year. That's not necessarily going to do it, so I'm working with the department to try and turn what we have into something approximating what the Member is talking about, understanding that, if we do want something like a guaranteed basic income, it is a decade away, as the Member stated.

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 835

Rylund Johnson

Yellowknife North

I recognize that, perhaps, times when I say it can be implemented tomorrow, the program delivery model still needs to be there, and it will take some time, and I appreciate that many of the hard-working ECE staff have been redeployed. I guess that was almost a yes that the Minister is willing to work with me and have some of these further conversations. I'm concerned that he feels he doesn't have the policy staff in the department right now. What efforts are being made such that the department has the staff who can actually develop a program or a roadmap so that we can have a meaningful conversation about this issue?

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 835

R.J. Simpson

Hay River North

On a regular basis, I badger the Minister of Finance and the Premier to give me more policy staff so I can pursue some of these types of initiatives, but, in the end, ECE does a lot of work. We provide a lot of people with a lot of support, and that's what the focus is on right now, especially during the pandemic.

I would love to be able to go out and get some more policy staff to do this type of work in the background, but I think that the staff we have right now are doing a great job at delivering services that are needed and being adaptive and responsive to the situation and, in this environment, those staff can learn from what's happening right now and work toward those types of improvements. Because, you know, this pandemic has taught everyone a lot of lessons, and I'm going to make sure that those lessons don't go to waste.

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 835

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Final supplementary, Member for Yellowknife North .

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 835

Rylund Johnson

Yellowknife North

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate that, and I will pester my other colleagues in Cabinet to try and get you some more policy staff. In the interim, to me, one of the hearts of a guaranteed basic income is allowing people to work and have that income not be penalized. I recognize that, in

Section 21 of the regulations, there is a formula for how people are penalized as they earn income on Income Assistance.

Right now, I believe this punishment is disincentivizing people from working, especially if you're also in public housing. By the time it comes around, if you've been earning a little bit of income and you're reassessed, you're losing half of your money. If you're earning $15 an hour in the Northwest Territories, it's more like you're earning $7 an hour, and I don't see any reason for someone to work like that. My question is: is the Minister willing to look at increasing some of the exemptions to allow people to earn more income on Income Assistance? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 836

R.J. Simpson

Hay River North

I've already done that work. Thank you.

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Question 236-19(2): Guaranteed Basic Income and Income Support Programs

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Page 836

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Oral questions. Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes .

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 836

Lesa Semmler

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Related to my Member's statement, sometimes I think, Ottawa, I don't know who has been talking to them and telling them how it really is in the North, and so that was why my Member's statement was talking about what some of the people in the North almost consider as normal. Can the Premier tell us if the government is lobbying the federal government to give us more resources to deal with some of those issues that I mentioned in my Member's statement? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 836

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes . Honourable Premier .

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 836

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will say that the Member has to be careful when she goes home to her riding. She might have offended a previous Minister who would say that every government in the Northwest Territories has lobbied hard to the federal government for additional money for the Northwest Territories, and I carry that forward. The reality is that every Assembly has asked for additional monies, and not only ourselves. We tend to partner as the three territories, with Nunavut and Yukon Territory, because we are all in the same situation.

Every government that I have known and that I have taken

part in, and this government, too, has talked about our opportunity gaps. We are not even the same place as the South. We don't have the highway systems. We don't have the bandwidth. We don't have the health centres. We don't have the housing. We have been saying that for many years. Now that COVID-19 has hit us, we are going in stronger, so now we're talking about how we started at a deficit with our opportunity gap, and it would not be okay for us to go back 50 years from where we've come. That is the message we carry forward all the time, that we need additional money for the territories because of this.

Every Minister sitting here is carrying that message, and I have to give credit to Nunavut and the Yukon Territory, who are all carrying the message, all three of us together. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 836

Lesa Semmler

Inuvik Twin Lakes

Thank you, Madam Premier , for your answer. There's another component to my question: we know we have talks of an election, maybe, in the fall, so do we have an idea of when we can expect more resources to flow north to help us, as a government, to tackle some of these issues?

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 836

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

How quickly they learn to be politicians. They know that there's an election coming up for the federal government. Actually, I have to say, in fairness to the Prime Minister, the Prime Minister has recognized, not only in this government, in the last Assembly, as well, that the territories are at a deficit. They have always given us extra money.

For example, for this Assembly, since COVID-19, I believe we got just over $23 million for the GNWT for our own COVID-19 expenses. We got $8.7 million for airlines. We got $35 million for businesses, and my understanding is that more will be coming. This is on top of the money that was given to every other jurisdiction, so the three territories actually have built strong relationships with the federal government, and we will carry that forward right through the election.

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 836

Lesa Semmler

Inuvik Twin Lakes

With COVID, like I said yesterday and today, it really highlighted a lot of our deficiencies, and I think, when we saw the money coming from the federal government flowing, it was almost like they are living the life that we have been living every day. That is our normal. That is why, all of a sudden, Ottawa opened up its pockets. I just want to make sure that they continue, the Ministers, and I know you've said it, but continue to press because, if we do have a federal election, we don't know how some of these things are going to change. Would the Premier commit to that, making sure that we are pushing hard, especially over these next few months until the fall?

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 836

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

Yesterday, I talked about being called names in here, some I don't accept and other ones I would accept. I haven't heard my name again being called as "easy." Talking about building relationships with the federal government is something that we are focusing on, positive relationships with them. It has proved to be fruitious. The other thing I am doing is also talking already about, and most Premiers are talking about, "What are we doing now?" We are starting to look at a recovery; but I have been talking about that since the beginning.

Every time we give something, like, for example, when we gave the extra money for childcare staff or childcare parents and stuff, and then, when we put people who were homeless into apartments, my conversations at the FMM table have been, "These are the right things to do, Mr. Prime Minister. How can you ask me to pull these back?" So I have already started the conversations and putting the bugs in. That is the message I will carry forward because, Mr. Speaker, it's right. How can I? If we have people who are homeless in housing, how can we put them on the street again? Those are not only questions that I ask because we need help. Those are the right questions to be putting at that table.

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Question 237-19(2): On-going Issues Facing the Northwest Territories

Oral Questions

Page 837

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Honourable Premier . Oral question. Member for Frame Lake .

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 837

Kevin O'Reilly

Frame Lake

Merci, Monsieur le President. My question is for the Minister of Finance who administers the NWT Wage Top-up Program. As I said earlier today, I support this program. However, it's not clear how it relates to, for example, the Canada Emergency Wage Subsidy. Can the Minister explain the relationship or difference between the NWT Wage Top-up Program and the Canada Emergency Wage Subsidy? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 837

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Frame Lake . Minister of Finance .

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 837

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The emergency wage subsidy provides a 75 percent subsidy to employers to encourage them to keep their employees on the payroll rather than laying them off during what might be more-than-lean times for those businesses,

whereas the wage top-up program, Mr. Speaker, is one that is meant to support employees who are making under a certain level of wages, of earnings hourly. In that sense, the two aren't necessarily related. Rather, they are not related, Mr. Speaker. Thank you.

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 837

Kevin O'Reilly

Frame Lake

I want to thank the Minister for that. Clearly, the wage top-up program serves a specific purpose just for us here in the Northwest Territories. Can the Minister, though, tell us how well that is going in terms of the take-up for it, in terms of the number of applications received so far for the wage top-up program, the number of employees covered, and how quickly the applications are being processed? I did give the Minister a heads-up, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 837

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

Yes, I was able to marshal a bit of information here for the Member. As of May 26, that is, as of yesterday, there have been 31 business applications to the wage top-up. The application has to come through the employer in order to top up the employee. Twenty-eight have already been processed, but three, we requested additional information. In total, this will benefit 242 employees, at least for the month of April. We are processing them retroactively. For April, that would be $65,000 going out into the hands of employees in the Northwest Territories.

At this point, processing takes approximately one day, unless again there is need for some further information or clarification, although that does seem to be, fortunately, the minority. Then the payment cycles about three days thereafter to go to the employees themselves. It is our intention in Finance to fast-track these applications, fast-track payments, as well, which Finance has been doing really across the board as much as possible for any incoming invoicing.

I would just note: applications have been open and operating since May 12 th . There hasn't been a flood at this point, Mr. Speaker, but there have been some coming in. To that extent, I would sort of acknowledge that perhaps the business community could continue to also work with their members to make sure their program is being promoted.

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

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Page 837

Kevin O'Reilly

Frame Lake

I want to thank the Minister for that. It's great to hear that 242 employees here are going to benefit from this right now. That is great. The turnaround time, I am really pleased, and I want to congratulate the Minister and her department for the hard work on that. Our minimum wage, though, is a measly $13.46 per hour, which is not enough for a decent standard of living in any of our communities.

Last time the minimum wage was increased was April 1, 2018. That process involved stakeholder committee. It looked a lot like the previous one. Given that the NWT Wage Top-up is a clear sign our minimum wage is too low and the evidence that it cannot possibly lead to a decent standard of living, can the Minister commit to a permanent increase of the NWT minimum wage to $18 per hour or higher?

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 838

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

I need to just take 10 seconds and actually go back to the genesis of the program, which was that, when Canada, the federal government, ruled out this CERB program for individuals who were negatively impacted, lost their jobs as a result of COVID-19, and they set a floor that would provide money to everyone, $2,000 into the pockets of people who had been negatively impacted, there very quickly arose, particularly in southern Canada, the fact that a lot of front-line workers were now incentivized to leave what might have been considered, at least perceptually, a higher risk profession, whether that was, in fact, true or not.

It became a real concern in the labour market that we were going to lose really some essential service workers and front-line workers.

That wasn't quite the case in the Northwest Territories. More of our health services and long-term care services are provided by the GNWT, which pays significantly more. While we wanted to participate in the program, the motivation for it here became really one of putting money into the hands of residents for whatever their needs might be. Whether that is to pay off debt or just increase spending in the community or childcare, anyone who was working, we sort of deemed as being essential for the purposes of this program. It really wasn't, at least in terms of our modelling, tied to minimum wage.

At this point, this program is not going to be some sort of pilot that the Department of Finance is using in terms of modelling for future for minimum wage changes. It really is quite specific to COVID-19, to acknowledge that there are people at the front lines, whether that is in grocery stores or otherwise, who might be making below a certain cut-off in an effort to participate in this federal program with as wide a berth as we could find in the Northwest Territories for as many employees as we could find in the Northwest Territories.

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 838

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Final supplementary, Member for Frame Lake .

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 838

Kevin O'Reilly

Frame Lake

Merci, Monsieur le President. I want to thank the Minister for that explanation. Look, I understand where this came from, but it's where it's taken us. That is the issue here. We heard the Premier yesterday say that it would be a sin to roll back the progress on some of these programs. This is one of the ones that it would be a sin to roll back. This program was not limited to essential services. It was for all people here who are paid minimum wage. They have to get the employer to do it, but that is what this is about.

Can the Minister make a commitment that she is going to work with her colleague, the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment , who actually is responsible for minimum wage, to fix this problem of a way-too-low minimum wage here for the Northwest Territories? We have started down that track. Let's fix it and make it permanent. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 838

Caroline Wawzonek

Yellowknife South

I have already been in touch with my colleague from ECE. Obviously, this does, as the Member has already identified, fall within the Department of Education, Culture and Employment. Mr. Speaker, my colleague was just on his feet, being asked if he was going to start a pilot for universal basic income. Some choices have to be made sometimes. We certainly can't have every single program that moves forward under COVID move forward forever. There will not be sufficient money to do that.

That said, Mr. Speaker, two things: the minimum wage committee is already underway for this year for this two-year cycle. They are supposed to be delivering a report to the Minister of ECE . Certainly, I look forward to that coming in to the Minister for ECE and , I am sure, will come to Cabinet in due course. Mr. Speaker, what I would also remind is that we are about to go into the business planning process, which means that departments do have that opportunity to go in and look at programs that are under way, perhaps in response to COVID-19, and determine if, in fact, that is something they want to make a pitch for to go forward. Then they can do that in due course. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 238-19(2): Northwest Territories Wage Top-up Program

Oral Questions

Page 838

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Oral questions. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh .

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 838

Steve Norn

Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Marsi cho, Mr. Speaker. On the way here, I just want to share something that made me chuckle a little bit. I heard on the radio a song by the band called Cake. There is a line referencing finding somebody who isn't afraid to cut through red tape with a machete. It made me chuckle. You know, I thought that was a pretty good song, and it made me think about this. It made me think about my Member's statement today, and I thought I will get right into my line of questioning.

Mr. Speaker, my questions are to the Premier as Minister of MACA . It's quite simple: why is your department holding a critical approval from the LKDFN for Frontier Lodge when the only thing that has changed since then is that the lodge is now owned by an NWT Indigenous community instead of nonresidents? Marsi cho, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 838

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh . Honourable Premier .

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 839

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It is not about because the only thing that changed was Lutselk'e Dene band, because I didn't even know that was the owner or not or whoever it is. The reality, Mr. Speaker, is that there was a change in ownership, and, with the change in ownership, they are looking for a liquor permit. If you are looking for a liquor permit, it's a little bit more difficult. You have to have not only a business licence but an occupancy permit, and then the fire marshal has to go in and do an inspection, so that is the difference. It's not only the owner; it's the request for a liquor permit at the lodge.

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 839

Steve Norn

Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

It's the Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation, just to make sure I got that right. Thank you for the response from Madam Premier . My next question is: how will putting the regulatory burdens on a struggling tourism business help us emerge strong from this pandemic? Why is a MACA licence now required for remote tourism operations?

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 839

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

The assumption is that this is a new policy, and, actually, it's not. It's always been in there that, if you are looking for a liquor licence, if you are looking for a liquor permit, that you need to have both. The reality is that my opinion is that we were a little bit lenient with lodges before. We did a review of the Fire Prevention Act, and then it really did confirm that all remote fishing lodges are subject to the building code. It just happened that this lodge was one of the first ones after that review, so it's not that we want to penalize. We want to help them, but we also have to make sure that people do follow the law.

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 839

Steve Norn

Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 839

Caroline Cochrane

Range Lake

I think it's important as elected officials to actually take ownership when things aren't too good, so I will take ownership on this one in that some of the delay over the couple of months was on our behalf, on the department's behalf, because COVID-19 hit us, and we were scrambling. All government departments were told, "You are now working from home," and we had to figure out what that looked like, so I do take ownership for some of that delay. That is our fault, and there is not much we can do about that. We are trying to work with them.

How I am going to fix it, though, is that we have already reached out and told them. We have reached out to the lodge. We have talked to the MLA. My commitment is, for any business, and not only this one because it was brought to the attention, when people are having problems with our systems, we are not trying to set businesses up to fail. We are trying to support them, but, if there is anything we can do, if people have obstacles, call us. In this case, we have agreed to walk with them, work with them, help them fill out the paperwork.

We have told them to perhaps get a consultant to go in and look at what they will need. We will work with people. We want people to succeed in the Northwest Territories. When you have issues, bring it to our attention, and we will try to address them.

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Question 239-19(2): Business License for Lutsel K'e Dene First Nation-owned Frontier Fishing Lodge

Oral Questions

Page 839

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Honourable Premier . Oral questions. Member for Kam Lake .

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 839

Caitlin Cleveland

Kam Lake

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are for the Minister of Industry, Tourism and Investment . On March 20 th , the GNWT announced a $13.2 million economic relief package for NWT businesses. This plan committed the GNWT to creating a business advisory council. This council has turned into a bit of a hurry-and-wait exercise for businesses that really want an opportunity to provide some feedback. Will the Minister make a commitment that the membership, meeting schedule, and terms of reference of the business advisory council be made public during this sitting? Thank you very much.

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 839

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Kam Lake . Minister of Industry, Tourism and Investment .

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 839

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The business advisory council is one of the three advisory bodies that our government is looking to put in place to guide our actions going forward. We have received initial input from the Members, so thank you for that, and we have incorporated their feedback into our terms of reference as well as our composition.

I appreciate it has now been just over two months since I and Minister Wawzonek first announced the proposed establishment of the council. It was partly due to our subsequent decision to establish the other two councils and then create an overarching theme between the three, so it did create some delays with getting the advisory council out. Our intent is that the role of the three advisory councils will complement each other so that we do capture as much as we can under the Indigenous community one, the health and social sector recovery, and then, as well, the business council.

We are working hard to ensure there is a broad, diverse representation on the council and that there are inputs. Admittedly, this has taken longer than we anticipated, and we do appreciate the Members' patience with that.

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 839

Caitlin Cleveland

Kam Lake

Does the Minister have an idea when we will see the first meeting of the business advisory council?

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 840

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

We have contacted the organizations that we are using to sort of staff or populate the councils, so the idea is to organize within either this week or by the end of next week a membership meeting with them.

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 840

Caitlin Cleveland

Kam Lake

Is it safe to assume that the membership, along with the terms of reference, will then be made public during our sitting this time around?

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 840

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

We definitely commit to having an open and transparent and collaborative government. I would like to actually have the conversation, though, first, with the membership as well as the two co-chairs of the council so that we can determine if that is the best movement for it. Personally, right now, I think that should be fine, but I do want to respect their privacy and their thoughts and whether or not they thought there needed to be some element of confidentiality around the council.

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 840

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Member for Kam Lake .

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 840

Caitlin Cleveland

Kam Lake

Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Should this be made public, which I hope it will be, is there an appeal process that the department has thought about, for if members of the business community would like to be able to be more readily involved or would like to be able to provide feedback to the terms of reference? Thank you.

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 840

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

With the way the structure of the council is working, it is to have the representatives be fed up through the organizations that we have contacted, so the idea being that those organizations will do the work themselves, and then their representative will bring it forward. Through that manner, members of those organizations will input on things within the council. I would imagine, as anything else, I have always expressed that my department is open to any sorts of feedback or comments or conversations, so I would still commit that again.

If there are people who have concerns about the council, they are very welcome to reach out to us and have that conversation, and we will go forward that way. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 240-19(2): Business Advisory Council

Oral Questions

Page 840

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Minister. Oral questions. Member for Thebacha .

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Question 241-19(2): Fort Smith Regional Airport

Oral Questions

Page 840

Frieda Martselos

Thebacha

Mr. Speaker, in a letter signed by all the leadership in Fort Smith, dated June 17, 2019, the leaders were clear in their disapproval of the proposed changes of the Fort Smith airport. However, Transport Canada and the Government of the Northwest Territories Department of Infrastructure went ahead with them anyways. My question is: upon receiving this letter from the Fort Smith leadership, were there any attempts made by the infrastructure department to modify or delay the project to fit the community's liking? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

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Question 241-19(2): Fort Smith Regional Airport

Oral Questions

Page 840

The Speaker

Frederick Blake Jr.

Thank you, Member for Thebacha . Minister of Infrastructure .

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Question 241-19(2): Fort Smith Regional Airport

Oral Questions

Page 840

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Since receiving the letter from Fort Smith leadership in June of 2019, the former Minister of the Department of Infrastructure and I have both provided multiple responses that explained why the decision was made to proceed with the project.

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Question 241-19(2): Fort Smith Regional Airport

Oral Questions

Page 840

Frieda Martselos

Thebacha

Why does the Department of Infrastructure continue to proceed with the airport infrastructure changes despite the community's leadership opposing them?

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Question 241-19(2): Fort Smith Regional Airport

Oral Questions

Page 840

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

Construction on the project began in May of 2019. Subsequent to that, Northwestern Air Lease, the local air carrier, and the town and local bands raised concerns to the Minister of Infrastructure and in the media. Additional information was provided to these groups to confirm that the concerns they raised were taken into consideration during the planning of the project, and to reaffirm that the level of service at the Fort Smith airport has remained the same. The project proceeded because it addressed the current and future operational needs of the airport.

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Question 241-19(2): Fort Smith Regional Airport

Oral Questions

Page 840

Frieda Martselos

Thebacha

Will the Minister admit that the community stakeholders and leadership of Fort Smith were not properly consulted, if at all, about these changes to the Fort Smith airport?

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Question 241-19(2): Fort Smith Regional Airport

Oral Questions

Page 841

Katrina Nokleby

Great Slave

Public engagement is a critical part of the way our government does business. It ensures that the GNWT is visible, accessible, and answerable to the people it serves. In this case, while we engaged with industry and regulatory e